Von Fauster Posted September 7, 2000 Share Posted September 7, 2000 So I'm playing a scenario when I get reinforced by three M7B1 HMC Priests. First I think "Cool", then I realize I have no idea what these are. Self-propelled arty- right? What are they used for? If they are artillery, how come I can't do indirect fire (Target Area)- or can I and I just missed it somehow? One cool thing though- two of them shooting at a tall building can knock it down in 1 turn. "Spotter? Spot this!" So anyway- what is the M7B1 used for, both in CM and in WWII? Thanks ahead-of-time for your enlightened, intelligent answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted September 7, 2000 Share Posted September 7, 2000 You are correct; it is SPA (Self Propelled Artillery). Indirect fire is not possible for any on-board artillery due to the extra setup this required. It is included in CM because sometimes it was pressed into service for direct-fire support to the troops when other armor was either not available or the extra power of the 105mm cannon was needed. The Wespe, Hummel and Sexton all fall in this category as well. ------------------ Canada: Where men were men, unless they were horses. -Dudley Do-right [This message has been edited by IntelWeenie (edited 09-07-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sailor Malan Posted September 7, 2000 Share Posted September 7, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Von Fauster: Self-propelled arty- right? What are they used for? ... One cool thing though- two of them shooting at a tall building can knock it down in 1 turn. "Spotter? Spot this!" So anyway- what is the M7B1 used for, both in CM and in WWII? Thanks ahead-of-time for your enlightened, intelligent answers. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I think you have already found what they are used for!! Keep them out of harms way, and deliver great big shells onto nice soft targets! ------------------ The conception of such a plan was impossible for a man of Montgomery's innate caution...In fact, Montgomery's decision to mount the operation ...[Market Garden] was as startling as it would have been for an elderly and saintly Bishop suddenly to decide to take up safe breaking and begin on the Bank of England. (R.W.Thompson, Montgomery the Field Marshall) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Von Fauster Posted September 7, 2000 Author Share Posted September 7, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sailor Malan: I think you have already found what they are used for!! Keep them out of harms way, and deliver great big shells onto nice soft targets! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I like the sound of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Michael emrys Posted September 8, 2000 Share Posted September 8, 2000 Speaking of sound, has anybody else noticed the cool sound of falling lumber when shells of 155mm or larger go off in a woods? It isn't really the sound of falling trees, I have to add, but I like it anyway. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howardb Posted September 8, 2000 Share Posted September 8, 2000 What about ranges? I'm sure artillery guns needs a little more than 500m for indirect fire, it's not a mortar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted September 8, 2000 Share Posted September 8, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Von Fauster: So anyway- what is the M7B1 used for, both in CM and in WWII?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> In WW2 one use was as anti-sniper weapon in urban warfare. If a sniper was pinpointed to a specific apartement, one 105mm HE would be enough to take him out, aiming for a window. This doesn't work very well in CM since buildings seem to have infinite armour, only letting a few frags enter through openings. In a recent game of CM I had two Priests located on a road some 100m out from a village held by the Germans. Apparently out of thin air in the village comes a Hetzer. Boom! Hetzer knocked out before firing even once. Two turns later a King Tiger enters from a side road, and I think "uh-oh, this will turn ugly ... BOOM! Never mind, the Priests took care of that one too before it knew what hit it (one-shot-kill). Soon a second Hetzer shows up, and promptly becomes a wreck. The only remaining German armour was a StuGIII, that I successfully close assaulted with two rifle squads after it had killed my Bazooka team. After the battle I discovered that all enemies had a Crack rating. Go figure... Gotta love those Priests. The standard M7 is now one of my favourite AFVs in CM . Cheers Olle [This message has been edited by Olle Petersson (edited 09-08-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PvK Posted September 23, 2000 Share Posted September 23, 2000 How does a 105mm HE round manage to knock out a King Tiger? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TelGerot Posted September 23, 2000 Share Posted September 23, 2000 My guess is that they were Hollow... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted September 24, 2000 Share Posted September 24, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by howardb: What about ranges? I'm sure artillery guns needs a little more than 500m for indirect fire, it's not a mortar <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> True, if fired indirectly. But SP artillery guns could be elevated or depressed much like a tank gun, and so could fire in a direct-fire role just like a tank. ------------------ Leland J. Tankersley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russellmz Posted September 24, 2000 Share Posted September 24, 2000 sp artillery is bad -ssed. according to 'citizen soldiers' at aachen, one german commander said the use of them to knock down points of resistence and buildings should be outlawed. plus, one shot from a 155mm could either destroy a pillbox or stun the germans inside(1 per pillbox). also, the priest carried armor rounds, just in case a tank came up ------------------ "They had their chance- they have not lead!" - GW Bush "They had mechanical pencils- they have not...lead?" - Jon Stewart on The Daily Show Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supertanker Posted September 24, 2000 Share Posted September 24, 2000 I love these things! An M7 is a wonderful tool for shredding dug-in infantry. Cheap, and plenty of ammo (88 pts for a regular one, IIRC). Sure, the Sherman 105 and the StuG42 carry the same main gun and have some armor, but they can't match the M7's price. Besides, as an allied player, I prefer the challenge of working with properly screened soft vehicles. I just used on last night to root out the AI's crack rifle squads. The M7 was one of the main units I wanted to play with in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
:USERNAME: Posted September 24, 2000 Share Posted September 24, 2000 The guy that wrote death traps claimed them to be one of the bettger weapons of the war. Also reading Soldat and the author describing the extra work and slowness of using horse drawn arty and then his getting his hands on a bunch of Italian trucks. Its just turn off the motor and get ready for bed. No watering the horses, grooming, etc. I bet priests and wespes and the like got over worked just because they were so mobile. Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Michael emrys Posted September 24, 2000 Share Posted September 24, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Supertanker: I love these things! An M7 is a wonderful tool for shredding dug-in infantry. Cheap, and plenty of ammo (88 pts for a regular one, IIRC). Sure, the Sherman 105 and the StuG42 carry the same main gun and have some armor, but they can't match the M7's price. Besides, as an allied player, I prefer the challenge of working with properly screened soft vehicles. I just used on last night to root out the AI's crack rifle squads. The M7 was one of the main units I wanted to play with in the game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Just wait 'til we get to CM2 and you find out about the ISU-152. You're gonna LOVE them! Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Bates Posted September 24, 2000 Share Posted September 24, 2000 What is a Hetzer? ------------------ "War is like the cinema. The best seats are at the back... the front is all flicker." - Monte Cassino by Sven Hassel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supertanker Posted September 24, 2000 Share Posted September 24, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Michael emrys: Just wait 'til we get to CM2 and you find out about the ISU-152. You're gonna LOVE them! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I'll just take an M12 in a patch or expansion disc, please. Speaking of "Death Traps" & M12s, the author writes, "In one incident, an M12 gun carriage with its 155mm GPF rifle loaded came around a bend in the road and suddenly found itself face to face with a King Tiger. Fortunately, the 155 was pointed directly at the base of the King Tiger's turret. The fun commander gave the order to fire. The 155 struck the King Tiger at the base of the gun mantlet where the turret joins the deck. The explosion ruptured the thin top deck armor and blew the turret off the tank, instantly killing the entire crew. Had the shell struck a few inches lower on the front glacis plate, it would have exploded harmlessly, and the King Tiger would have been able to drill the M12 from end to end with its high-velocity 88. Such were the fortunes of war." (p. 171.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathman Posted September 24, 2000 Share Posted September 24, 2000 M Bates, a Hetzer is a gerbil found only in the remote parts of the Black Forest. It was commonly used in the latter parts of the war when the inventory of more heavily armoured panzers became scarce. As far as their effectiveness is concerned, I'm not real sure about that, although I believe it was General "lightning" Joe Collins who stated, "I can deal with panthers and tigers, but those sonofabitchin Hetzers got me flummoxed"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted September 29, 2000 Share Posted September 29, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PvK: How does a 105mm HE round manage to knock out a King Tiger?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> reply: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TelGerot: My guess is that they were Hollow...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> TelGerot is correct. A hollow charge straight at the KTs broadside was all it took to knock it out. Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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