Mord Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 Hey guys, I am almost done with the US formations but can't locate some of the unit insignias. I have exhausted my sources and am hoping you guys might be able to plug a couple of the holes. I also need some Luftwaffe info. I am not sure how to proceed with the Luft armor and armored infantry as far as a division shields go. I can't find any decent info on Luftwaffe armor. Were there any divisions of Luft armor? Or more importantly any in the CMBN time frame? I also found that there was a Herman Goering training Bat in Holland during MG. Would they have been just infantry? Ok here are the US formation DUIs I am missing; 94th ID ------- 302nd Arm Infantry Reg 319th Arm Eng Bat 95th ID ------- 320th Arm Eng Bat 4th AD ------ 53rd Arm Inf 5th AD ------- 22nd Arm Eng Bat 10th Tank Bat 6th AD ------- 9th Arm Inf 44th Arm inf 7th AD ------- 17th Tank bat 31st Tank Bat 23rd Arm Inf Bat 38th Arm inf Bat 48th Arm inf Bat 33rd Arm Eng bat 10th ----- 3rd Tank Bat 11th Tank Bat 21st tank Bat 20th Arm Inf 61st Arm Inf Any help would be appreciated. Mord. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Grey Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 Well... there ever was only ONE division within the Luftwaffe having armor and armored infantry: The so-called Fallschirm-Panzerdivision "HERMANN GÖRING". Everything else were more or less standard infantry divisions. Technically not the whole division might have beena round, but we have the OOB in the game, so you have to do the portraits. ;D 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akd Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 In CMBN + MG, the Sturmgeschütz Brigade under both Luftwaffe Armored Infantry and Armor is Fallschirm-Sturmgeschütz-Brigade 12, an independent unit under II. Fallschirm-Korps. I don't know why it was added to both sections. Luftwaffe Armored Infantry should probably be empty and inactive. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pak40 Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Mord, I assume you have Shelby Stanton's book Order of Battle: U.S. Army WWII? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinnart Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Mord, try Wikipedia. They have lots of insignia graphics. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pak40 Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Ok here are the US formation DUIs I am missing; 94th ID ------- 302nd Arm Infantry Reg 319th Arm Eng Bat 95th ID ------- 320th Arm Eng Bat I think you accidentally listed these as armored which obviously isn't the case since they're in Infantry divisions. Anyway, Stanton's book has the insignia for the 302nd Infantry Regiment (and most other regiments and divisions), but doesn't have any insignias for the battalion level. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mord Posted November 14, 2013 Author Share Posted November 14, 2013 Well... there ever was only ONE division within the Luftwaffe having armor and armored infantry: The so-called Fallschirm-Panzerdivision "HERMANN GÖRING". Everything else were more or less standard infantry divisions. Technically not the whole division might have beena round, but we have the OOB in the game, so you have to do the portraits. ;D Ok. Cool. So, I'll give that HG training Bat the Goering Div Symbol. But that would only apply to Arm Inf and Armor? No Paras and regular Infantry, right? In CMBN + MG, the Sturmgeschütz Brigade under both Luftwaffe Armored Infantry and Armor is Fallschirm-Sturmgeschütz-Brigade 12, an independent unit under II. Fallschirm-Korps. I don't know why it was added to both sections. Luftwaffe Armored Infantry should probably be empty and inactive. So, I can add Fallschirm-Sturmgeschütz-Brigade 12 to the paras, but not the Regular armored Infantry. So, if the Luft didn't have any Armored Div besides HG where did they get their armor assets from? How did they organize it? By battalion? Mord, I assume you have Shelby Stanton's book Order of Battle: U.S. Army WWII? Nope using all internet sources. I found a site that list the US OOBs in the ETO. Mord, try Wikipedia. They have lots of insignia graphics. LOL that's a given...nothing for any of the stuff in my list. At least not that I could find. I think you accidentally listed these as armored which obviously isn't the case since they're in Infantry divisions. Anyway, Stanton's book has the insignia for the 302nd Infantry Regiment (and most other regiments and divisions), but doesn't have any insignias for the battalion level. Damn...yeah, they are typos. So it should read 302nd Inf Reg, 319th & 320th Eng Bat. Mord. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Grey Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Ok. Cool. So, I'll give that HG training Bat the Goering Div Symbol. But that would only apply to Arm Inf and Armor? No Paras and regular Infantry, right? Correct - the "HG" division was the only mechanized formation the Luftwaffe ever had. (Admitted, they formed a second Panzergrenadier division later, but we're talking Eastern Front here.) Technically they never fought in Normandy - only Africa, the Mediterranean and the Eastern Front, but we have them in the game, so... So, if the Luft didn't have any Armored Div besides HG where did they get their armor assets from? How did they organize it? By battalion? Organization is pretty much like a standard Panzer division. (Although I'm sure some soldiers transferred from the airborne or from a field division to "HG".) Around that time the division would have had roughly the following OOB: - PzRgt "HG" (2 tank + 1 StuG battalion) - PzGrenRgt "HG" 1+2 (3 armored infantry battalions each) - PzAufklAbt "HG" (1 armored recce battalion) - FlakRgt "HG" (2-3 Flak battalions) - PzArtRgt "HG" (3-4 armored artillery battalions) - various support battalions like signals, engineers, medical troops etc. Assets were already assigned to the division before the war started, so they didn't steal or borrow form the army or something like that. Göring just asked for the material and got it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akd Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Correct - the "HG" division was the only mechanized formation the Luftwaffe ever had. (Admitted, they formed a second Panzergrenadier division later, but we're talking Eastern Front here.) Technically they never fought in Normandy - only Africa, the Mediterranean and the Eastern Front, but we have them in the game, so... I think you are mixing up CMFI and CMBN. There is no TO&E for HG division in CMBN. Hermann Goering Training and Replacement Regiment would be a leg infantry formation in Market Garden, but there is no specific TO&E for this in the game. There is only one formation under Luftwaffe Armor and Armored Infantry in CMBN: a StuG brigade. This is Fs-StuG-Brigade 12. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mord Posted November 14, 2013 Author Share Posted November 14, 2013 Thanks, Earl. Hermann Goering Training and Replacement Regiment would be a leg infantry formation in Market Garden, but there is no specific TO&E for this in the game. So my best bet would be to use the HG division symbol with the Luft Infantry to best represent this? There is only one formation under Luftwaffe Armor and Armored Infantry in CMBN: a StuG brigade. This is Fs-StuG-Brigade 12. Ok. I found the StuG Brigade 12 shield so I am all set as far as it goes. So, to sum this all up...the only armor in the Luft during the CMBN/MG time period would be StuG Brigade 12? If someone were playing strictly historically that would be it? The Luft had no other access to any armor during France and Holland? Mord. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Grey Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 I think you are mixing up CMFI and CMBN. There is no TO&E for HG division in CMBN. Hermann Goering Training and Replacement Regiment would be a leg infantry formation in Market Garden, but there is no specific TO&E for this in the game. Quite, yes - I've been switching between the different games so often now that I indeed confuse things now and then. (Even though I wrote it myself that "HG" never fought in Normandy or on the Western Front at all...) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mord Posted November 21, 2013 Author Share Posted November 21, 2013 Ok the SS has plain infantry as a choice in the editor but I can't find any divisions that would fall under that heading. Were there any regular Waffen divisions in the CMBN time frame? Far as I can tell most Waffen divisions were armored/armored infantry. Mord. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clavicula_Nox Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 A good number of them were Grenadiers, Cavalry, or Mountain, only some of the W-SS divisional formations were actually armored/armored panzergrenadiers/motorized panzergrenadiers. Examples off the top of my head: 6th (Mountain) 7th(Mountain) 8th(Cavalry) 13th(Mountain) 14th 15th 19th 20th 21st (mountain) 22nd(Cavalry 23rd(Mountain) etc. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akd Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Ok the SS has plain infantry as a choice in the editor but I can't find any divisions that would fall under that heading. Were there any regular Waffen divisions in the CMBN time frame? Far as I can tell most Waffen divisions were armored/armored infantry. Mord. In the timeframe and setting of CMBN, there was this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/34th_SS_Volunteer_Grenadier_Division_Landstorm_Nederland That said, I think SS infantry in CMBN is generally meant to represent various second line formations (training, school, etc) that were drawn into the fighting around Arnhem. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mord Posted November 22, 2013 Author Share Posted November 22, 2013 Thanks guys. Don't know how I missed the 35th. I thought I'd read through all those and couldn't find anything that dealt with CMBN time frame. I'll use that insignia and then I'll have a generic shield to represent scratch units. I could not find anything pertaining to the Naval Infantry Divisions so I just made a set of generic portraits using the yellow eagle on a shield. Mord. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.