Hardcore_javier Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Hi! this is my first thread and post...well I have 2 question. The first one is the jagdtiger killer tank fought in the OP market garden? and second is if the jagdtiger fought in that battle you will include it?. Im from chile btw. I love the combat mission series. (sorry for my english) Abrazos y saludos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakla1027 Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Hello, & welcome to the CMBN forum. Well I'll just say this, it's not very likely you'll get any info on the specs of upcoming BF games & modules, let alone details on units & equitment within those products. BF makes outstanding games. Nobody else come close, but yet they run a tight ship, mum is the word. So needless to say you are just another person, among many many others, that are waiting for the next bit of news from BF. However it is ALWAYS worth the wait. Dont let any of this stop you from posting on the forum though. This is a really really good forum full of all kinds of information, helpful people, and good lively debat & discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ts4EVER Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 The Jagdtiger was not used during Operation Market Garden. It was first used during Operation Nordwind in alsace early in 1945. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 The Jagdtiger was not used during Operation Market Garden. It was first used during Operation Nordwind in alsace early in 1945. Weren't any used during the Bulge in December '44? I have a recollection of reading something along those lines, but it's pretty vague so I'm not taking any bets at the moment. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASL Veteran Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Weren't any used during the Bulge in December '44? I have a recollection of reading something along those lines, but it's pretty vague so I'm not taking any bets at the moment. Michael I'm sorry Mr Emrys but your recollections are incorrect :eek: . Some US veterans claim to have encountered them, but the German records show that none made it in time to participate. "With 7 Jagdtiger, the 1 Kompany schwere Panzerjager Abteilung 653 departed from the Dollersheim Training Area on 7 December 1944 to take part in the upcoming Ardennes Offensive. The departure railhead was at Gopfritz an der Wild. The initial transport of the battalion to the designated operationl area Gemund Kall Schleiden was unsuccessful. All of the battalion's transport trains were blocked by the completely bombed out rail lines. All the forces and supplies intended for the offensive had to remain in the Mosel Valley or in the Eifel Mountain Range." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardcore_javier Posted February 17, 2013 Author Share Posted February 17, 2013 thx for all the replies and the welcome honorably comrades!. So..the jagdtiger fought in the battle of bulge and not in the OP market garden.much appreciate for the quick response. I just finished the commonwealth campaign...im so exited! I want information of the upcoming module! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ts4EVER Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 thx for all the replies and the welcome honorably comrades!. So..the jagdtiger fought in the battle of bulge and not in the OP market garden.much appreciate for the quick response. I just finished the commonwealth campaign...im so exited! I want information of the upcoming module! no the jagdtiger did not fight in the battle of the bulge, only in operation nordwind and later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steiner14 Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Hardcore javier, do not forget, you are not allowed to use single Jagdtigers but only in full formation and you are not allowed to use them as support weapons in combined attacks. They are intended for smashing tank concentrations on the operational sized scale. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Hardcore javier, do not forget, you are not allowed to use single Jagdtigers but only in full formation and you are not allowed to use them as support weapons in combined attacks. why not? :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanonier Reichmann Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I'm guessing he means that these were how Jagdtigers were used historically (hysterically?). To my way of thinking, if I've coughed up the money to purchase the appropriate module that includes Jagdtigers, I should be able to use them however I damn well like! Stuff hysterical nonsense. Regards KR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I'm guessing he means that these were how Jagdtigers were used historically (hysterically?). I think he's referring more to the "official doctrine" of their use, which was observed, AIUI, more in the breach than the adherence. Significantly more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 use them however I damn well like! Stuff hysterical nonsense. Damn skippy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I think he's referring more to the "official doctrine" of their use, which was observed, AIUI, more in the breach than the adherence. Significantly more. Ya, I always get a giggle when the goosesteppers start babbling on about how perfect a German [thing] was. As if they didn't have to give pilot claims at least a 50% haircut, despite the supposedly rigorous claiming process, to get them within cooee of reality. And as if all twelve panzer divisions in Normandy wasn't organised and equipped differently to all the others, despite the existence of oober kewl kstns that were supposedly applied consistently. Etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I'm sorry Mr Emrys but your recollections are incorrect... That's why I asked. Thanks for the info. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardcore_javier Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 I saw a documentary of the battle of bulge and the testimonies of the sherman's crew. they got hit by a jagdtiger shell 128 mm cannon. The jagdtiger where in a platoon with jgpz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASL Veteran Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I saw a documentary of the battle of bulge and the testimonies of the sherman's crew. they got hit by a jagdtiger shell 128 mm cannon. The jagdtiger where in a platoon with jgpz. Yeah, I saw that one too. They were mistaken because according to German records there weren't any Jagdtigers where the US crew said they saw them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Yeah, I saw that one too. They were mistaken because according to German records there weren't any Jagdtigers where the US crew said they saw them. There's this one, for example: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=138065 but Morsbron is a really long way from the Battle of the Bulge area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASL Veteran Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 There's this one, for example: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=138065 but Morsbron is a really long way from the Battle of the Bulge area. That would be Jagdtiger number 332 from 3 Kompanie 653 heavy tank destroyer battalion. Number 332 was destroyed by an air attack sometime around 16 March 1945. The Jagdtigers are very well documented. You can almost see a photograph of every single one that was destroyed and locate it on a map. In fact, I have a book that does just that. As if all the other evidence of no Jagdtigers in the Ardennes isn't enough, even Hitler asked about them during the battle itself "When reports of this were given to Hitler, he promptly asked about the Jagdtigers. Herbert Buechs, at OKW, gave the news to the Fuhrer. "A check has been made," he said "The transport trains bringing the Jagdtigers forward from Dollersheim have been stopped by air attacks on the planned rail route." Apparently Hitler's reaction was not recorded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardcore_javier Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 Amazing pictures! the jgdtiger is a beauty...If the German army had concentrated its production capacity in the Jagdtiger I'm sure they would have won on the Russian front Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardcore_javier Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 That would be Jagdtiger number 332 from 3 Kompanie 653 heavy tank destroyer battalion. Number 332 was destroyed by an air attack sometime around 16 March 1945. The Jagdtigers are very well documented. You can almost see a photograph of every single one that was destroyed and locate it on a map. In fact, I have a book that does just that. As if all the other evidence of no Jagdtigers in the Ardennes isn't enough, even Hitler asked about them during the battle itself "When reports of this were given to Hitler, he promptly asked about the Jagdtigers. Herbert Buechs, at OKW, gave the news to the Fuhrer. "A check has been made," he said "The transport trains bringing the Jagdtigers forward from Dollersheim have been stopped by air attacks on the planned rail route." Apparently Hitler's reaction was not recorded. I'm imagining how Hitler took the news! xd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childress Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 The Jagdtigers were plagued with mechanical problems, lack of fuel, cumbersome loading procedures and inexperienced crews. But they scored some notable successes. From Wikipedia: Tiger ace Otto Carius commanded the second of three companies of Jagdtigers in Panzerjagerabteilung 512. His memoir Tigers in the Mud provides a rare combat history of the ten Jagdtigers under his command. He states that Jagdtigers were not utilized to their full potential due to several factors: Among them that Allied air supremacy made it difficult to move, the massive gun needed to be re-calibrated from jarring after traveling off-road for even short distances[5] (Note: This particular problem was attributed more to the 8 wheel Porsche type suspension which proved unfit for off-road terrain, causing excessive vibrations which over a short period could throw the gun out of calibration. More modern 9 wheel Henschel type suspension system from the King Tiger was thought to have less of this particular problem: which type Carius commanded is unknown), it was slow, and transmissions and differentials broke down easily because the whole 72 tonne vehicle needed to rotate to traverse the gun. The massive gun had to be locked down, otherwise mounting brackets would have worn too much for accurate firing. Also a crew member had to exit the vehicle in combat and unlock the gun before firing.[6] However, he also recorded that a 128 mm projectile went through all the walls of a house and destroyed an American tank behind it.[7] Insufficient crew training and poor morale was the biggest problem for Jagdtiger crews under Carius' command. At the Ruhr pocket, two Jagdtiger commanders failed to attack an American armored column about 1.5 km (1 mile) away in daylight for fear of attracting an air attack, even though Jagdtigers were well camouflaged.[8] Both vehicles broke down while hurriedly withdrawing through fear of air attack which did not come, and one was then destroyed by the crew. To prevent such disaster at Siegen, Carius himself dug in on high ground. An approaching American armored column avoided the prepared ambush because German civilians warned them of it.[9] Later, one of his vehicles fell into a bomb crater at night and was disabled, and another was lost to Panzerfaust attack by friendly Volkssturm troops who had never seen a Jagdtiger before.[7] Near Unna, one Jagdtiger climbed a hill to attack five American tanks six-hundred meters away and below; two withdrew and the other three opened fire. The Jagdtiger took several hits, but American projectiles could not penetrate the 250 mm (9.8 in) frontal armor. However, the inexperienced German commander lost his nerve and turned around instead of backing down, exposed the thinner side armor, which was eventually penetrated and all six crew members were lost. Carius wrote that it was useless when crews were not trained or experienced enough to have the thick frontal armor facing the enemy at all times.[10] When unable to escape the Ruhr pocket, Carius ordered the guns of the remaining Jagdtigers destroyed and surrendered to American forces.[11] The ten Jagdtigers of 2nd Company, Panzerjagerabteilung 512 destroyed one American tank for one Jagdtiger lost to combat, one lost to friendly fire, and eight others lost to breakdown or destroyed by their crews to prevent capture. On 17 January 1945 two Jagdtigers used by XIV Corps engaged a bunker line in support of infantry near Auenheim. On 18 January they attacked four secure bunkers at 1,000 meters. The armored cupola of one bunker burned out after two shots. A Sherman attacking in a counterthrust was set afire by explosive shells. The total combat included 46 explosive shells and 10 anti-tank shells with no losses to the Jagdtigers. During April, s.Pz.Jäg.Abt.512 saw quite a great deal of action. Especially on 9 April 1945, where the 1st company managed to engage an Allied column of Sherman tanks and trucks from dug-down positions, and managed to destroy 11 tanks and over 30 soft-skins, with some of the enemy tanks having been knocked out from a distance of more than 4,000 m. The combat unit only lost 1 Jagdtiger in this incident as Allied ground attack P-47 fighters appeared. During the next couple of days the 1st company managed to destroy a further five Sherman tanks before having to surrender at Iserlohn. Meanwhile the 2nd company still fought on, but with little result. On 15 April 1945, the unit surrendered at Schillerplatz in Iserlohn without fighting.[12] One major success of the Jagdtiger was on 19 December 1944 in the early days of the Battle of the Bulge. Two Jagdtigers were overwatching the town of Noville. An American armored column consisting of eighteen Shermans were on their way to counterattack the attacking German forces, according to military records nine Sherman tanks were destroyed by the Jagdtigers and three were disabled from a range greater than 2 miles. The Sherman column never identified what was engaging them and were forced to fall back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 Amazing pictures! the jgdtiger is a beauty...If the German army had concentrated its production capacity in the Jagdtiger I'm sure they would have won on the Russian front Why stop there? By this logic, the Germans should of concentrated their all their production capacity on the Pz. VIII Maus... Yeah; that's what the Germans needed more of in 1944/1945: an overweight, unreliable, fuel-guzzling "superweapon". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardcore_javier Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 Why stop there? By this logic, the Germans should of concentrated their all their production capacity on the Pz. VIII Maus... Yeah; that's what the Germans needed more of in 1944/1945: an overweight, unreliable, fuel-guzzling "superweapon". Okey the jagdtiger would won in the most sexiest tank killer magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 Amazing pictures! the jgdtiger is a beauty...If the German army had concentrated its production capacity in the Jagdtiger I'm sure they would have won on the Russian front They might have also needed to increase their production of bridging equipment. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 Why stop there? By this logic, the Germans should of concentrated their all their production capacity on the Pz. VIII Maus... Or super battleships. You know, the ones that can also fly. Surely they would have won the war. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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