Italian Artillery - suggestions needed.

[SelfLoadingRifle]

Winning the firefight without any real firepower of your own... This seems to be the name of the game when commanding the Italians as I am finding out the hard way in the scenario 'Lemon Hill'. My infantry are only armed with rifles, the Breda M30 LMG is such a crappy piece of kit that the gunners might just as well be using rifles and my AB41 armoured cars have all the resilience of wet blotting paper to incoming enemy fire. The only way I will be able to crack this particular nut is by using my artillery.

I have Brixias, but they have a maximum range of 500m which means that they are comfortably outranged by the on-map American artillery. The terrain is open and advancing them to a position from which they can bring down effective fire without being cut to ribbons is much easier said than done.

But wait... I have priority of fire from two 65mm artillery pieces that are set up somewhere off-map. The trouble is that, as the rule-book states; "the royal Italian Army did not have any radios in their infantry formations at all, instead relying on pre-established field telephones (and) messengers carrying written orders for communications."

Blimey! Serious question: how did the Iti dropshorts go about the business of bringing effective fire down on the enemy? Were Aldis lamps or semaphore flags involved - and more importantly to me as the O.C. how long did the process take?

The only radios in my ORBAT are those fitted into my AB41s and given the baco-foil like quality of the armoured cars using the two troop commanders as FOOs would be nothing less than suicidal:confused:

So just how am I supposed to use my off-map artillery? Is a pre-registered barrage at the start of the scenario the only real option? Any/all suggestions would be most gratefully received.

Many thanks,

SLR:)

[womble]

I think you'll find some of your HQs have access to those 65mms in their arty call pane. If they have it in setup phase (in order to set up a prearranged bombardment) they'll still have it once the game begins. Things like those field telephones and messengers are abstracted out, and a unit that has permission to call arty can call it whether they have a working radio or not.

[akd]

Winning the firefight without any real firepower of your own... This seems to be the name of the game when commanding the Italians as I am finding out the hard way in the scenario 'Lemon Hill'. My infantry are only armed with rifles, the Breda M30 LMG is such a crappy piece of kit that the gunners might just as well be using rifles and my AB41 armoured cars have all the resilience of wet blotting paper to incoming enemy fire. The only way I will be able to crack this particular nut is by using my artillery.

I have Brixias, but they have a maximum range of 500m which means that they are comfortably outranged by the on-map American artillery. The terrain is open and advancing them to a position from which they can bring down effective fire without being cut to ribbons is much easier said than done.

But wait... I have priority of fire from two 65mm artillery pieces that are set up somewhere off-map. The trouble is that, as the rule-book states; "the royal Italian Army did not have any radios in their infantry formations at all, instead relying on pre-established field telephones (and) messengers carrying written orders for communications."

Blimey! Serious question: how did the Iti dropshorts go about the business of bringing effective fire down on the enemy? Were Aldis lamps or semaphore flags involved - and more importantly to me as the O.C. how long did the process take?

The only radios in my ORBAT are those fitted into my AB41s and given the baco-foil like quality of the armoured cars using the two troop commanders as FOOs would be nothing less than suicidal:confused:

So just how am I supposed to use my off-map artillery? Is a pre-registered barrage at the start of the scenario the only real option? Any/all suggestions would be most gratefully received.

Many thanks,

SLR:)

FO/HQs do not have to have radios to call for artillery. Off-map artillery will always be in contact.

[Sublime]

I would recommend pre planning any heavy arty fire with the Italians unless you have TRPs. I PBEM'd Lemon Hill as the Italians and won. Took a lot of casualties though, and my opponent fortunately did not site his US assets as well as he could have. If he had, it could really have changed things. Your armored cars, are very important for suppressive fire, but the real killers are the Brixias. More than anything else. Other than that, its all about overwhelming fire with your infantry, preferably from different directions. And not being shy about taking losses. Pretend you.re in the American Civil War recreating Pickett's Charge

[DMS]

By the way, for future east front games simulating field telephones (may be they would be set like TRP's before the battle?) and messengers would be usefull. Messengers are simultated in general (you can send soldiers to inform ally unit about enemy units)

I dream abot extra-iron mode, where you can order only to units that are in chain of command.

[John Kettler]

DMS,

Do you mean like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yy8mxh0P63M

I would further observe that all that commo gear--wire, spools, handsets, switchboards and more, not to mention radios farther up the command chain--almost certainly was U.S. Lend Lease. It's fair to say, I think, the Red Army would've been up the creek without the gear we provided and which their manufacturing was not set up to provide, having focused on the bare basics: tanks, artillery, small arms and aircraft. And ammo. Lots and lots of ammo. I believe you'll find this link highly pertinent in the relevant categories. If you've never seen what we provided, I believe you'll be impressed. General Leslie Groves, who ran the Manhattan Project, pitched a huge fit over the shipment of nuclear materials to Russia.

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/pearl/www.geocities.com/Pentagon/6315/lend.html

Regards,

John Kettler

[womble]

I dream abot extra-iron mode, where you can order only to units that are in chain of command.

Until the TacAI gets a lot better any such dream would be a pointless nightmare.

[John Kettler]

DMS,

PE already has this and has since 1999 or so. Of course, you command only a platoon. Oh, and there's no God's eye view. Never was. My nonexistent kingdom for the formation commands and fire control orders in which you issue them and generally get the desired outcome.

http://www.allgame.com/game.php?id=19276&tab=controls

Regards,

John Kettler

[DMS]

DMS,

Do you mean like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yy8mxh0P63M

I would further observe that all that commo gear--wire, spools, handsets, switchboards and more, not to mention radios farther up the command chain--almost certainly was U.S. Lend Lease. It's fair to say, I think, the Red Army would've been up the creek without the gear we provided and which their manufacturing was not set up to provide, having focused on the bare basics: tanks, artillery, small arms and aircraft. And ammo. Lots and lots of ammo. I believe you'll find this link highly pertinent in the relevant categories. If you've never seen what we provided, I believe you'll be impressed. General Leslie Groves, who ran the Manhattan Project, pitched a huge fit over the shipment of nuclear materials to Russia.

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/pearl/www.geocities.com/Pentagon/6315/lend.html

Regards,

John Kettler

Red army had wires and telephones, but some were lost, so lend-lease supplies were usefull. During first part of war radios were few, 1 per battalion. (and not for 100% units) Main communication gear were wired telephones, even high command who had radios preffered wires, as they were considered more reliable and silent for enemy. Units were 100% equipped by communication gear only in 1944. So, messengers and tight formations will be only choice for red players.

What's about lend-lease, it's role was high after 1942. While battles of Moscow and of Stalingrad it's part was less.

Until the TacAI gets a lot better any such dream would be a pointless nightmare.

As alternative feature - why not?

[John Kettler]

DMS,

I wasn't saying the Red Army had no wire commo of its own. Rather, by the U.S.'s providing all those goodies, Russia was able,singlemindedly, to produce the sinews of war, except for trucks, also supplied by us and which revolutionized the Red Army. Did you enjoy the linked items?

Regards,

John Kettler

[DMS]

DMS,

I wasn't saying the Red Army had no wire commo of its own. Rather, by the U.S.'s providing all those goodies, Russia was able,singlemindedly, to produce the sinews of war, except for trucks, also supplied by us and which revolutionized the Red Army. Did you enjoy the linked items?

Regards,

John Kettler

Yes, sure buying lend-lease goods was very helpfull during the war.

I liked this:

Pianos, new 2 530$

Shotguns 1 25$

Pipes, tobacco 1 10$

Really full list. Tobacco pipe for comrade Stalin?