LUCASWILLEN05

It seems Putin has admitted to this. If this is in any way accurate how are we supposed to trust his word on anything else? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l70umjfaBPI

Yes, I see Hitler as a possible parallel but also similarities with Bismarck

I think e are all capable of recognising as Putin-bot when we see one. If it looks like a Putin bot and acts like a Putin b then it probab;ly is a Putin bot!

Russia would be better letting Ukraine go although that might come at the cost of some of the Russian speaking regions. Dual nationality for Russians and Ukranians within the current borders might al;so be part of a negotiated solution. The rest of Ukraine has quite a lot to offer the EU - prime agricultual land and an educated population. If all the old industry has gone (it would likelyy go anyway) Ukraine has the oppportnity t build a modern economy. Russia of course will lose out on that and on any chance of becoming a part of the European Community at any time in thje forseeable future.

I haven't even seen troops use grenades yet! Maybe it's just me!!

Ukraine has a right to decide its' own destiny. If they want to move twards NATO and the EU who can blame them after the way Russia treated them. On the same principle the Russian minority have a similar right. But it needs o be done at he conferance table, not on the battlefield.

Indeed. Nobody is completely innocent. Even prir to WW2 there was consderable distrust of the Soiet Union and, after \WW2 through failures on both sides we had almmost four decades of the Cold War and that perid continues to cast a long shadow. Russia is at lleast as deserving of criticism as the West. And ayway, this thred was suposed to be about the Baltic States' role in 2017

I found the BS US campaign quite easy as a casual but exxperienced wargamer. Achieved a magor victory with moderate casualties. Andbesides you can change the difficulty level in campaigns anyway

I am not saying this is a bad source but, as a historical document it is obviously biased. Though I would use it I would be extremely careful and seek balancing sources from the oher side to corroborae evidance

I think the Austrians, Czechs and Poles might have something to say about that! Just as the Ukranians. Latvians, Estonians/Iithuanians and the Poles will have a few comments about the Soviet Union!

Besides, the T-80 is kind of here - it's the Ukranian T-84 and the BM Oplot which are variants of the T-80UD. See P99 of the manual. As Alexey says the T-80 is no longer in service in the Russian army and he offers an interesting insight into why. Essentialy it seems to be moey and government corcts.

In other words I want me empire back! Russia needs to learn that theSovie Union is gone, just as Western European nations had to accept he end of empire after WW2. Russia can be a well respected country but respectmust be earned - and that isn't the way to do it.

Anyway, getting back to the Baltics http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-31759558

So we might say that the breakup of the Soviet Union was forced on them by the circumstances of the time. If we added the word "Discuss" that would look like a History graduate essay question

S, Ivanov qoutes 46 million, Boris Sokolv 43 milliion which come pretty close http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties_of_the_Soviet_Union

Correct. If 20 million dead then 30million wounded seems a reasonble figure. Hence 50 million dead and wounded could be a fair figure.

Russians have not disclosed everything about their military history in WW2 wth many battles and campaigns not disclosed at all for decades. And thei accunt of Prokhorovka given at the time and relied on for decades afterwards has quite recentl been shown up to be, shall we say, smewhat frudulant wih Sovet losses under stated. German losses heavily inflated including Panthers (which II SS Panzer Corps did not have at the time and more Tigers than hey had engaged or even started with. An illustration of how numbers be manipulate and used for political reasons

that might be dead and wounded. both military and civillian http://warchronicle.com/numbers/WWII/deaths.htm

No worries. Sometimes it is easy to mis-read

Erik, I did not qoute that figure,

Shall we just agree all sides have reason to be fearful and indeed even paranoid for a range of historical reasons going back over at least he las few hundred years and take it from there

I would agree. The Baltic States might certainly have cause to feel thretened by Russ. Russia occupied the Baltic Staes incrporating them int the Tsaris Empiire, then in 1940 and finlly in 1944 having "liberated" them from the German occupation. AAnother example of why Russia's neighbours might be cncerned about Russian regional ambitions as they would percieve it.Russia and the West (United States) also regard actions by the other side in a very negative way given the attitude of mutual fear and paranoia.

Numbersare often disputed. A typical example of national bias. Russia might downplay the numbers, ukraine might inflate them. If we were to pick a figure between the two claimsthat might be more accurae.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-31747754

Kuri I am guessing you might be Ukranian? I m British/Swis dual nationality by the way