Snake Eyes

How much HEAT would a woodchuck chuck, if a woodchuck could chuck HEAT? Well, a woodchuck would chuck all the HEAT he could chuck, if a woodchuck could chuck HEAT. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

BTS probably won't have enough time and resources to include all the rare vehicle types in CM2. However, they have shown a willingness to include a few rare vehicles in CMBO and I suspect they will do the same in future releases. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

A prototype Sturmtiger participated in the German attempt to contain the Polish Home Army's Uprising in Warsaw beginning on August 13, 1944. After its successful debut it was returned to Germany on August 28. This Sturmtiger saw action in Starowka and Mokotow districts of the city. One of the rounds, which failed to explode, is on display in the Wojska Polskiego Museum in Warsaw. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop [This message has been edited by Snake Eyes (edited 02-16-2001).]

I'm looking forward to seeing at least one multi-turreted Russian tank in CM2. The most likely candidate would be the T-28. It had three turrets; the main turret had a short 76.2mm while the two secondary turrets had MG's. The T-28 entered service in 1933 and was used in the war with Finland in 1940. It was discovered that the thin armour (10-30mm) was easily penetrated by Finish AT gunners. Applique armour was added increasing it to 10-80mm. The new model was designated the T-28E. Total production of T-28's (1933-1940) was around 600. Another tank I'm looking forward to seeing in CM2 is the JS-2 (aka IS-2), and in particular the m model with the thicker turret armour (160mm). It carried a 122mm main gun which packed 3.5 times more kinetic energy than a 76.2mm. In the unlikely event that the round failed to penetrate the force of the impact and the explosion of the HE filler was enough to blow the turret off of any tank. The JS-2 entered service in April 1944. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

I don't think that would happen, but if you're having fun, so what? ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

You're on! PBEM is best for me. eMail me a setup. I'll take any side, any type of action, any force mix, any...you get the point. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

The name of the game is combined arms. If your units can't support one another you're in trouble from the start. Heavy and super heavy tanks are at a distinct disadvantage in this regard in CMBO; they bog/immobilize easily. You can try using them cross-country and hope, or you can stick to roads and limit their effectiveness. Very seldom do you find a nice overwatch position 1000m behind the main action for them to perch. Give me vehicles that can get down and dirty with the grunts, like the M8 GMC and the StuG42. They ain't pretty, but they carry a big infantry knocking stick. Also, I think too much ego gets invested in these GAMES and this limits the fun. Were real battles always balanced? I think not! Most of the time they were unbalanced. The trick is to learn how to cope and do the best you can when you find yourself on the short end. The advantage of CM is that it's only a game and you will live to fight another day and another battle. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

One last pass through page 1 before it drops off the radar screen forever.

As promised I have added up the votes for the rare and not so rare vehicles from the 'Rare Vehicle Poll' thread. There were many very interesting entries, some very strange entries and some...well let us call them not so serious entries. The top three winners are as follows: 1. M16 Multiple Gun Motor Carriage 2. Maus Super Heavy Tank 3. Brummbär and SturmTiger (tied) First place goes to the M16 Quad .50 cal MG 'Meat Chopper' and its relative the M15, a 37mm combined with two .50 cal MGs. These vehicles fall into the not so rare category. The US produced 680 M15s in 1942, 724 M16s (based on M3 HT) in 1942-43 and 1000 M17s (based on M5 HT) in 1943-44. These vehicles also represent a major interest in AA vehicles since many other such vehicles were registered, like the Canadian Skink and the German Kugelblitz. These latter two being truly rare vehicles. BTS will not be adding new vehicles to CMBO, but the Russians received 100 M15s and 1000 M17s via Lend Lease, so we can hope to see them in CM2. The Maus represents Hitler's obsession with super heavies. This behemoth weighed in at 208 US tons and had max armour of 240mm. It mounted a 12.8cm/L55 gun. A co-axial 7.5cm/L36.5 gun was also to be included. Max speed was 20km/h (12.5 mph) which it attained during testing. Only two prototypes were completed and neither entered service. This is definitely a dream (or nightmare) machine for players. At the scale of CM the appearance of such a beast would be a real shock to the opposite side. Its use would be restricted to firm ground and roads. Don't even think about crossing a bridge. The SturmTiger (aka Sturmmörser) had max armour of 150mm and had a 38cm mortar firing a rocket-assisted round up to 4600m. It's biggest drawback was its very slow rate of fire; 8-10 minutes to reload. 18 vehicles were produced. The Brummbär is another not so rare vehicle with 298 being produced from 4/43 to 3/45. It had max armour of 100mm and had a 15cm/L12 main gun. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

SturmTiger, Kattenkrad, Skink, Meatchopper; register your favorite rare and not so rare vehicle.

Stalin's paranoia of the military and the subsequent purges crippled the Russian army leadership. This led to the disastrous retreats in 1941. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

The purpose of this thread is to register a show of interest in certain vehicles. Hopefully BTS will take note and include the more popular vehicles as circumstances warrant.

bump

Great picks so far. Keep them coming! ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

Please feel free to vote for rare and not so rare vehicles that missed CMBO. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

3 1) 3 2) 0 3) 11 4) 3 5) 3

Quite often on this forum a thread appears concerning the inclusion of rare vehicles in CM, CM2, etc. Usually a swirling debate ensues over the reasons to include these vehicles and the limited resources available to BTS and how these resources should be applied to the core game only. BTS has shown a willingness to include some rare vehicles in CMBO, but only as a lower priority. I hope to see additional rare vehicles included in each of the future CM modules. To this end I suggest that you post a few of your favorite rare vehicles and not so rare vehicles that missed CMBO. I will total the numbers so that BTS has an idea of which vehicles are most popular. My picks: German SturmTiger Russian T28 US M16 ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

Lend Lease M18: 5 Lend Lease M10: 52 ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

Let me suggest that Charles start with the T28. It has ONLY three turrets. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

I understand that BTS has limited resources. Nonetheless, it's the squeaky wheel that gets the grease. The Forum is the place to register your squeaks, right? ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

I don't think BTS should overlook the fun aspect of including some of these 'questionable' AFV's. Unlike the Maus, the T35 was fully functional. Including the T35 in CM2 opens the doors to more 'what if' scenarios. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Elijah Meeks: ...the fact that the MP44 was the original assault rifle...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I think it can be argued that the BAR was the original assault rifle. It was developed to be a LMG, but it doesn't fit that role very well. Any other opinions? ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

I've had a PIAT take out a Tiger I from the front at 42m. I've also had a PIAT take out a StGIII at 193m. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rex_Bellator: It's a shame it didn't work for you though!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I don't expect miracles from the TacAI, but this situation was enough to cause this old grog to whisper a few expletives under my breath. The Hellcat was firing uphill and could have easily hit the exposed lower hull of the Panther only 18m away. The angle must have been close to 0 degrees. Even AP can penetrate in such a situation. Not using tungsten was like pouring salt into an open wound. Oh well, CM does enough things right that I can accept this sort of thing from time to time. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop

In a recent PBEM game a Panther crested a small rise with a veteran Hellcat on the opposite slope. At 18m the Hellcat bounced FIVE AP rounds off the big cat; one turret hit and four upper hull hits. With 76mm rounds ricocheting off its armor skin the Panther slooowly turned its turret and adjusted the elevation, aiming its powerful 75/L70 at the Hellcat. The US crew immediately jumped ship, the Panther never fired a shot. Abandoning a Hellcat at that point was not the stupid part. It was the fact that a lower hull hit by any of the five previous shots would probably have penetrated. Oh, by the way, the Hellcat had 6 Tungsten rounds and didn't use a single one. And yes, I'm on 1.1b24. ------------------ It is easy to be brave from a safe distance. -Aesop