Wilhammer

Can we recover? Many posts between this morning and this evening in this thread have vanished.

That explains why Shandorf has just blasted one of my StugIIIs with an M36B1, he does not like Shermans. But his Sherman in the rear on the first turn of the game, clear across the map, must of been over 750 meters, killed my Ps234/3 with one shot, not 10 seconds into the battle. Also, this guy has some crack or elite sniper somewhere, or maybes its a .50 cal, but it keeps my Tigers buttoned up on the dominating crest. This is a worthy American opponent. We have just started, and my Germanic assault is concerned already about this "American" who "Hates Shermans". Bahh. He loves Shermans.

Qoute from danielh [What we have here, is that testdata and the design suggest a strong advantage, but what is lacking is actual testimony from both sides in combat. (Also the germans should have had noticed such a gain in lethality...).] The problem for this system is that it was tied to guns that were not good German tank killers. I doubt you would report the hits that did nothing but bounce off. In the heat of battle, you would not even know it many times. Was it a tank round? A mine? Artillery? Grenades? Something fall in the back? The Gyro tied to an effective weapon means poor lethality, more hits, but no damage.

What kind of ground? Anything that the tank can move on, even on a boat if need be The only limitation is if the slope going up is greater than the gun can depress relative to the selected plane to keep the gun on, the opposite situation of going down slope. As a naval gun on glassy sea, or rolling waves, the gun cares not for the surface the tracks are on, only the slope.

Gyro advantage vs Optics advantage. So far, and correct me if I am wrong, but no one has yet explained how the Gyroscope thing works, but we know how the optics work--a crisper image. I'll do my best to explain the gyroscope. Sorry for those who already know, but let's make sure all of us know. Essentially, to target a gun you need to point it in the right direction and know the correct range. The Zeiss optics did a very good job of this, and I have no doubt it helped at long range. The device is complicated, and requires some brains, many of which had been splattered all over the Eastern Front by now. The Gyroscope in the US tanks was adopted from the Navy. The Navy uses it to maintain gun elevation while they are moving constant relative to the target. The gun mount floats with the Gyro, which maintains the gun at level or a selected elevation while cruising over choppy water and through wakes. It was the employment of gyrostabilizers that resulted in the possibility of the now familiar long range gunnery duel. Before that, Naval battles were at very close range, under 5000 meters. What does this have to do with a Tank? Simple, the tank moves over the ground and the barrel that is gyro-stabilized will follow NOT the lay of the land, but the chosen elevation. Half the problem of aiming the gun is basically solved for a tank on the move. The Zeiss optics advantage, if in in fact their is one, is in clarity and the calibration tick marks for shooting targets. Fine, but I remind you it was complicated, so it is best used when you got some time and you are NOT MOVING. Zeiss optics would give you no advantage, and would be worthless in their complexity, while on the move in battle. A non-Gyro tank's gun will follow the lay of the land as it moves, thus neccesitating a huge adjustment if they need to move the gun up if they are going down slope, etc. The Gyro tank will need make only fine adjustments, thus laying the gun on the target much quicker. The gunner has far less work to do. BTS Quote[shooting on the move without gyros - next to impossible. Shooting with the gyros - quite possible.] As for shutting it off. Well, its probably exagerated how much it was shut off (I think it is one of those oft-occuring Squad Leader Urban Legends), but I bet some did shut it off. If the unit had no combat experience, and it broke, they may not fix it because it is under-appreciated. Those tanks that might be usually employed in Infantry support might not need it as they normally would not be hunting tanks, so they might let it fall into disrepair. Also, if a tank is travelling on a road expecting no opposition, they might shut it off in order to keep the breach from moving up and down while they are trying to relax on their "Sunday" drive. Has any one asked if some ignored the Zeiss optics? Well, I think some if not many did. You don't need a scope to shoot a deer at close range, you use the iron sites. At close range you don't need all that complication to get a good shot. When quoting or depending on limited sources, remember that the goal of many is to sell their product. When reading war accounts, be wary as well. You watch the news? Good, then you know that it is the unusual that gets the spotlight, not the usual. Thank you for your time.

On PAPER they had a lot of choices. In reality, they were lucky to get what they got due to the fact they were mostly on the run, under air interdiction, and the "over-specialization" bug. The over specialisizing of the Wermacht provided many pitfalls...favorite formations and commanders would get the better stuff. This same over specializing also contributed to logistical problems caused by favoritism to supply "targets" and the need to supply a large army with a huge diversity in weapons systems. With CM, we are all provided the oppurtunity to be the "favored" commander or formation. The truth in the war was very few could get this favoritism. The problem for the CMer, is that in a given situation, a German company or battalion commander DID NOT get to choose, he GOT what was available. the Americans were under the a similar constraint, but its use of standardized equipment and air superiority contributed to this being a significantly less problem than it was for the German. The solution is to provide for a Rarity Option as is promised for CM2. What I have not heard is; Will this be retrofitted into CM:BO? If not, then for the historically minded gamer, we will have to modify our QBs with some house rules. In recognition that many CMers are non wargamers but just gamers, the use of Rarity as an Option should satisfy them. The weakest point of CM right now, in my opinion, is that the QB system is lacking in Historical Simulation Quality. It is excellent for its TO&E/Diversity Simulation Quality. The rest of CM is outstanding in it's representation of History.

When considering US Army from the field analysis of German tanks anf tank subsystems, you must remember we are a nation of salesmen, and a strong effort was being made to get theUS armor board to allow the US heavy tanks, tank-killing tanks. The armor board was dead set against it. They saw tanks as supporting infantry and the breakthrough. It was the TD battalions job to kill tanks. The proof is tha the MBT, as shown by the Germans and in the post war by US and the old Soviet Union, is optimal in all three roles. So, all German guns and tanks were 88s, all tanks were Tigers or Panthers, and the optics were almost as good as X-ray glasses.

Screwed up by accident is different from screwed up on purpose. If I left the impression that you screwed up purposefully, I am sorry, for that is entirely not the case. As I state in the other thread, my rebuttal response recognizes the correctness of your costing arrangements. The problem is the unfettered ability of the German player to buy the best all the time, and the Allied best is significantly less than the the Average type of unit available to the German player. Perhaps we should use things like Fionn's "Rule of 75s" to include "Rules of Likely Formations".

All points well taken, and as I stated within my posts, some data was missing or not yet analyzed. Further, I completely agree with you in the comparison of the 2 squads, the pattern 44s, but I also make the point that that particular German squad is one of the worst in the game. Interestingly enough, this entire exercise was borne of a desire to have a "Buyer's Guide" for QBs for when I played the German side, as the selection of squads is daunting due to the huge variety. The statistical disparity I may have detected in the Cost/FP analysis raises a valid concern, do you not agree? Some quotes and responses. "If Bill thinks that the firepower numbers for Allied units should have slower Ammo usage than the Germans, I once again disagree." Steve, I gottat agree with you here. I did not consider the fact that GIs had semi-auto weapons. My argument though is that an SMG will expend bullets faster than a semi-automatic rifle, thus my feeling that SMG squads should expend "Ammo Points" faster, and since this reduces the number of available firing oppurtunities, then perhaps they should have smaller ammo loads due to a higher rate of consumption. Again, I do not know the innards of your game, and for all I know this does happen. I have not looked that closely. "If Bill's position is that the Allied squads are not priced correctly vs. the Germans"... That is my position, and it still is as long as the German QBer can choose from his pool without restriction or concern about historical availability. But, my point is that the German QBer has a vast pool of troops to choose from that makes it likely he will have the stronger force simply because he can maximise "bang for the buck". In the same vein, "And if the LMG42 of the German squad is lost, a reduced US Squad can kick its ass at any range, not to mention a full sized one.", a circular argument as the GIs could loose the BAR guy. Also, this squad that is getting its ass kicked is the 18th worse squad in the German mix, mostly fitted with bolt action rifles. I'm worried about the more heavily armed guys in the top 10. The Best American squad to buy, overall, is not better in "statistically normalized" firepower than say a VG HVY SMG Squad or the Fallschimjaegers. My comparison of cost vs FP was not a comparison to one squad type, but to the entire available pool of German Squads and MG teams available for purchase by the QBer thus illustrating how difficult it SEEMS for the American or Biritsh player to buy a equal force when you consider the choices the German player has. I agree with the way you priced the units in CM based on equipment, but the cost does not take into account the actual availabilty of these troops. "Basically, I disagree with everything except for the issue of "Rarity". But that is not something that is relevant to a discussion of cost:benefit, but rather constraints on the player outside of this narrow study." Ahh, but this is the entire underlying point of this discussion. My ultimate point is that the German player purchasing for a QB has some very effective purchases he can make that can devestate under the right circumstances. Imagine taking on the SMG squads in the streets or dense woods? The Americans have no squad with that kind of firpower at short range, and my study illustrates the need for....Rarity! The "Final Answer". How likely are there to bo some Fallguys or German Alpine troops? If they are in the sector, sure, but they were not everywhere. Is it safe to say that the prevalent German Squad type was somthing similar, if not, the pattern 44s and 45s? I agree wholeheartidly with your FP values for the units. Many a GI history or battle history points out that some German units were devestating to encounter simply because they were better equipped, better trained, and more highly motivated. Have I not read that some German Regimental size units had as much direct firepower as any Allied Division? And finally, In my first post, I asked "Does this seem about right?" becuase I did not really know. Obviously, the only way to get the absolute best handle on this is throught doing a firepower/cost analysis down to the individual weapon. My analysis was based on the raw firpwer values as reported in CM at ranges 40m, 100m, 250m, 500m, 1000m. The formula used to generate the "normalized value" was to calculate avg. FPs in ranges 40m-250, 40m-500m, 40m-1000m, Averaged those averages, and then averaged this weighted average to all the averages, thus minimizing "spikes". However, this does mire the details in statistical averages, so a weapon by weapon analysis is in order. First, I will play some CM and take all of your points into account, and see what happens on the field. But again, the point is that the German can make some ahistorical choices in purchasing units that at least SEEMS to provide him with an unfair advantage in making the "Cost:Benefit" choices any good manager must make. Thanks for a great game and a well written rebuttal.

I do NOT think that the you guys are German-centric. Far from it. I am referring to those gamers that are, not you guys. Heck, you goave us the first useful 60mm mortar in a game. I do think the QB system could use some tweaking. I am definitely interested in your counter-points, actually thrilled. I have not had any of my posts analysed and likely corrected by the "Best Wargame" designers ever.

Slighted is a strong word, but it is the word or its concept that pro-German players would take if they had "under-rated" units. Steve, I have the utmost praise for your fine effort. It is the best wargame ever, but it is by no means the end of the line in terms of wargame developement. I play it an awful lot, I currently have 4 PBEMS underway, and my willingness to put considerable effort in "Doing some Numbers" displays a desire to see the system represent in the best way the subject it covers. The thread Slapdragon is referring to, http://www.battlefront.com/discuss/Forum1/HTML/011102.html I will gladly admit any error I might of made, but the analysis I ran does suggest some inherent inequity in point allocation between the nationalities, a problem that hinders QBs from being balanced. I feel it also impacts the Historocity of the game when a QB is generated. As for the actual FP numbers, I have no argument with them. The US Army was fairly standardized, while the Wermacht had a collection of different TO&Es that were awesome at times and driven by the fierce inter, intra, and extra service rivalry that was endemic to the German war machine. If I offend by presenting my case, well it is true that the essence of conversation is the argument. [This message has been edited by Wilhammer (edited 10-01-2000).]

You know, if the German units are slighted in any way, what an uproar we would have. This weekend, it has been shown that a good chance exists that the Allies, especially the Americans, have been slighted across the board. Perhaps it is besy we put the whole "Allies are slighted" thing to rest, as it apparently is so trivial, no general concern is forthcoming.

OK, I know how to make Explorer "act" many ways through many dialog box selections. However, how do you change the default presentation of "File Opening" boxes, like the one you have when you open CM for PBEM? I would like this "mini-explorer" box to always open the same way, files sorted by dates with a detail view. Right now, I just get an Alpha listing. I can get that look I want my manually selecting it, but I really want to change the default setting. Anyone know? I suspect it is a registry thing. [This message has been edited by Wilhammer (edited 10-01-2000).]

The Company thing is a whole other project that will take some time. However, if you look at my data and then see how it was processed into what I posted, mathematically, it will not mean a thing in relative differences of a potential parallel Cost/FP analysis. This is an exercise in relative firepower of weapons systems and their costs, so since I limit FP to small arms and MGs, and only concern myself with Squads and MG teams, I feel this is analysis enough, and any magnification in increasing the formation size would essentially "wash" out. However, when I can make the time, I will take the data I have that is the basis of the analysis, make spreadsheet representations of the Platoons and Companies, and another comparative analysis. I feel the Germans will come out slighly better still as they have the most awesome team weapon in the game, and lots of them, the Heavy MG 42. I have thought of another point; All squads carry 40 "units" of ammo. German units on average have about 25-30% greater firepower. FP is a direct function of the amount of lead, or number of bullets that can be placed on a target. This is at least 95% directly related to ROF. This means then, that the German units carry a lot more ammo around than the Americans do. About 30-40% per squad more. I bet a SMG squad would go through a similar pile of Ammo that a US 44 squad would go through at least twice as fast. The German squads have fewer men, so less ammo carriers. With the average squad of Germans being 9.1, and the US being 11.6, a roughly 20% difference---well, them German troops must have some mighty big and strong backs to carry approximately 50% more ammo than a GI can. I postulate that due to the high ROF weapons the German squads have, the abstracted 40 units of ammo per squad (A time abstraction for the most part) may be too generous when compared to less FP units. I am aware that the weapons deliver their bullets at different velocities and sizes, as well as accuracy, but if you think for a moment, comparing the two sides' weapons really means that FP is almost a 1:1 correlation with ROF. Thus, to have a higher FP, one must expend more rounds of ammo faster, thus creating a greater consumption of ammunition.

Why are the Hamsters PanzerGrenadiers, one and all? Why, its because these are natives of Hamburg. The term meaning "citizen of Hamburg" we are more familiar with, Hamburger, was created after the great Kitty Power made their historical impact, thus forever changing the term from "Hamster" to "Hamburger". And now, the great Kitty power is proud to export Hamburger franchises all over the world. Of course, this has created a whole new problem on the world's roadways, the trash from the Hamburger wrapper, better known to some as "Kitty Litter".

Experience vs. official TO&E. Would it not be unreasonable to assume, and were GIs not famous for, enhancing their TO&E? If a bunch of veteran or crack GIs realize they are going into town for some close in fighting, don't you think they would beef up the Bar and SMG supplies? In afuture version of CM, perhaps we could have flexible TO&Es thar are "more" flexible based on the Nationality, its expereince and the situation? After all, many a US unit was quite well equipped with a new addition to its TO&E, the captured Panzerfaust.

This is a thread from another BBS. It has been referenced here before. http://www.hitechcreations.com/ubb/Forum9/HTML/000686.html

Excel's convertor and its interaction with UBB...dang it. What does a CM QB simulate? A company command gets an order to go to this place and do something, and they have a choice of forces, know what the terrain is generally like, and know what size the enmy force could be. So, this fictitious commander is told to select from an available pool of troops. Unfortunately, our virtual pool contaains 21 different types of German Squads, among other things. This means that in a scenario a German QB purchaser could buy the best knowing that it is ahistorically available. This study is by no means complete. How even is the situation when the selection of forces is limited, say the German can only get Heer? Is the available pool of infantry more even? I do not yet know.

Firepwoer values concern only small arms, MGs. No other weapons are included. Americans have rifle Grenades, so as an anti-infantry weapon, this should be about equal to a PF. An American 44 Rifle squad has 209 FP at 40 meters, 10M1s at 130FP, 1 SMG at 44 FP and 1 Bar at 35 FP. A German 44 Squad has 6 K98 Bolt Action Rifles at 39 FP, 2 MP40 at 72 FP and 1 MG42 at 50 FP for a total FP of 161 at a range of 40 meters. BTW, the German 44 squad is one of the worst FP rated squads in the game. At a range of 40m, it ranks at number 18 in a list of the 21 different German squad types. Here is the list in an Excel Converted HTML table.<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>German Squad FP Ranking</TITLE></HEAD><BODY><H1><CENTER>German Squad FP Ranking</CENTER></H1><Table border> <TR VALIGN="bottom"><TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Fusilier SMG Squad</FONT></TD><TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">324</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">99</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">4</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Gebirgsjaeger Pioneer Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">315</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">133</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">39</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">20</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Gebirgsjaeger Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">315</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">133</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">39</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">20</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Volksgrenadier SMG Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">288</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">88</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">4</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Fallschirmjaeger Pioneer Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">281</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">164</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">76</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">39</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Fallschirmjaeger Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">281</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">164</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">76</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">39</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Sturmgruppe Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">271</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">174</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">87</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">43</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Volksgrenadier Hvy SMG Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">256</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">144</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">67</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">38</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Fusilier Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">249</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">116</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">41</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">21</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Panzergrenadier Pioneer Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">241</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">156</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">81</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">42</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Motorized Infantry Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">228</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">151</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">79</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">41</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Panzergrenadier Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">215</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">141</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">73</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">39</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Volkssturm Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">201</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">107</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">40</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">20</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Sicherung (Security) Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">190</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">104</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">46</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">23</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Rifle 45 Squad (German)</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">178</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">106</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">49</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">23</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Volksgrenadier Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">178</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">100</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">45</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">22</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Escort Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">162</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">122</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">72</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">40</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Rifle 44 Squad (German)</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">161</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">99</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">49</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">24</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Motorized Pioneer Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">148</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">94</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">47</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">23</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Rifle Pioneer Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">131</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">93</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">51</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">25</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial">Volksgrenadier Pioneer Squad</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">102</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">87</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">54</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">26</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial">0</FONT></TD> </TR> </Table> <FONT SIZE=-1> Last Updated on 9/30/00 By Bill Wood <FONT SIZE=+0> </BODY> </HTML> [This message has been edited by Wilhammer (edited 09-30-2000).]

On the face of it, a German squad looks vulnerable to rapid degradation due to a loss of a man compared to a GI. In fact, the Firepower of a German squad is so much higher, they inflict casualties quicker, and soon the man count can become quite even. The best defense is a strong offense.

Sorry for th huge space in recent post. I've tried, but I cannot remove it.

Hope this works. I have pasted in the summary data for the analysis worksheet. Fernando, my oversimplification of the data in my first post produces an anomaly. Please review this post. "I" type Units are squads. "S" type units are MGs. <HTML><HEAD><TITLE>CMAnalysisSummary</TITLE> </HEAD> <BODY><Table border> <TR VALIGN="bottom"><TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD><TD ALIGN="center" COLSPAN=5><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>Average Cost per Unit Firepower Comparison</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" COLSPAN=3><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>Per Man Comparisons</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">Relative FP Cost Analysis Summary</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>Avg Avg</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>Wavg</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>250m</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>500m</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>1000m</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>Avg Cost / Man</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>FP / Man</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1>Avg Man Count</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">German I</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.357</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.349</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.285</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.354</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.443</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>4.056</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>11.981</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>9.100</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">German S</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.314</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.309</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.264</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.308</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.373</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>5.375</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>17.403</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>4.000</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">Overall</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.336</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.329</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.275</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.331</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.408</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>4.715</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>14.692</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>6.550</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">American I</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.398</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.388</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.311</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.397</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.497</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>3.404</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>8.850</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>11.600</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">American S</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.369</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.364</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.315</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.363</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.435</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>4.625</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>12.990</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>5.000</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">Overall</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.384</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.376</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.313</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.380</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.466</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>4.015</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>10.920</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>8.300</FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">American I Premium</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>11.41%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>11.09%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>9.39%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>12.27%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>12.27%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-16.05%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-26.13%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">American S Premium</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>17.68%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>17.86%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>19.02%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>17.73%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>16.54%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-13.95%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-25.36%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">American Overall Premium</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>14.34%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>14.27%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>14.03%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>14.81%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>14.22%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-14.86%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-25.67%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" SIZE=-1> </FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">British I</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.387</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.377</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.304</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.386</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.482</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>3.475</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>9.487</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">British S</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.389</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.385</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.336</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.386</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.450</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>4.083</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>10.606</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">Overall</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.388</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.381</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.320</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.386</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>0.466</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>3.779</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.000"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>10.046</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">British I Premium</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>8.33%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>8.08%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>6.72%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>9.01%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>9.01%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-14.31%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-20.82%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">British S Premium</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>24.13%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>24.64%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>26.91%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>25.27%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>20.78%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-24.03%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-39.06%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> <TR VALIGN="bottom"> <TD ALIGN="right"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow">British Overall Premium</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>23.82%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>23.35%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>20.88%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>25.29%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#0000FF>25.08%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-29.69%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center" STYLE="vnd.ms-excel.numberformat:0.00%"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow" COLOR=#FF0000>-42.27%</FONT></TD> <TD ALIGN="center"><FONT FACE="Arial Narrow"> </FONT></TD> </TR> </Table> <FONT SIZE=-1> Last Updated on 9/30/00 By Bill Wood <FONT SIZE=+0> </BODY> </HTML> [This message has been edited by Wilhammer (edited 09-30-2000).]

Using the CM Unit Database by gauchi as a starting point, I have put together some quick data sheets both for handy in battle reference and for purchasing for QBs. During the purchasing analysis, I made some observations: 1. A US soldier costs about 15% less than each German soldier, but has about 26% less firepower than the German soldier. Soldier means per man. 2. A US Infantry Unit (Squad or MG Team) costs about 14.4% more per unit of Firepower than a German Unit. For each equivalent purchase of infantry units, the Americans will have more individual soldiers on the Field, but fewer combat units, and just 74% of the German firepower per man, 85.6% FP per Squad. Except for Airborne, US squads have 12 men, and all with an average FP of 8.85 per man at a cost of 3.4 pts per man. German Squads have, on average, 9.1 men per Squad with an Average FP of 11.98 per man at a cost of 4.715 pts per man. Does this sound about right?

Relative costs. 1. I'd say Allied, esp American stuff is too expensive, considering that the production of Sherman tanks in one year exceeded all German AFV production for the entire war. Not to mention, we had trucks and cars enough for each man in the field to have one. 2. German artillery is too effective, and its cost is similar to American. Germans surveyed everything and took care of all plot variables as needed. The Americans used a "Database" like approach in which they did all the variables before hand, set up banks of plot tapes, and dragged out the right tape based on a set of conditional variables already stored in the database. Germans depended on wire, and its complicated system relied on highly trained personnel. The American had to know how to read a map, select the right tape, and know the distance and angle to the coordinates. They used radios. This Artillery combat net allowed the infamous "TOT" barrage, wherein multitudes of batteries delivered the barrage on Time on Target at the same time, without spotting rounds. Translation, German artillery was relatively inflexible and took about 15-20 minutes to deliver. American artillery could drop a barrage in 2-3 minutes, and anyone with a radio could possibly do it from NCOs up. The artillery game system, as is common with nearly all WW2 wargames, is based on the German system. This design decision slights the American cause. With the current system, upping the delivery time for German artillery should be done. 3. Jeeps were used for recon, but typically the jeep was stopped and the crew got out, often dismounting the MG if need be. The .50 MG Jeep would be just about right if the crew could get out. 4. Germans infantry have a tremendous amount of firepower. Now, the TO&E may indicate they had it, but I just completed an Excel Infantry Cost Analysis spreadsheet, and the German Infantry, on a Firepower/Cost asessment are on the order of 0.285 points per unit of Firepower while Americans average 0.311 points per unit of Firepower, a 9.12% premium for American Squads, on average. Given that the Americans had a nearly endless pool of ammunition, spare parts and replacements, I would expect it should be the opposite. BTW, if anyone wants to see my "Combat Mission Unit Cost Analysis", drop me a line at billwood@triad.rr.com. When it is done, I will see if MadMatt will post it for all to use. My comments, for now. If you want a more realistic balance of costing, I highly suggest the American players get a 10-20% handicap in purchasing. BTW, CM is the best wargame I ever played. It is more and more attractive to me each day. It occuppies my thoughts and much time. Gotta love it. Bill

Vehicles should be cheaper for Americans relative to other countries vehicles, especially the logistical vehicles. The reason is that they were as plentiful in the US Army as men. I think a lot of the problems could be solved if the US vehcicle list was added to (having the ability to buy a M-16 will divert money from jeeps). Another way to solve the problem would to be to create another category so that we would have Armor, Vehicles, and Light Armor, that includes Lt. AFVs, Armored Cars and other light armed vehicles like armed HTs. The current vehicle category would be left for logistical vehicles/transports. Upping vehicle costs will not change gaminess. Heck, just buy a platoon or two of green or conscript troops, split the squads, and deploy a skirmish line. I do like the idea of bonus points for survivors and surviving equipment. Bill