Franko

I was reading Steve's post in another thread. He stated that Operations will not be featured in Combat Mission Normandy, nor will Campaigns -- although the concept of Campaigns may be possible in future additions. Or words to that effect. Well, here's the exact quote: "From our perspective the CMx1 Operations system was a failure. It made a very, very small number of people moderately happy, a slightly larger number somewhat entertained, and the majority unimpressed. Which is why we do not have an Operations type system in CMx2 and never will. It's very obvious to us that this is the wrong direction to "evolutionize"." I want to go on record that I'm disappointed that Operations will not be featured in the new game, although it appears that Operations were featured in CMSF. So I'm baffled, a little, about the fact that operations were excluded, based on the statement that operations are excluded in CMx2 -- I thought CMx2 was based at least in part on CMSF. I may be missing something. However, I always enjoyed the operations system in CMx1. Sure, it had its limitations, particularly with respect to redrawing "front" lines, between scenarios, map orientation, placement of reinforcements, etc. But a good scenario designer could design around the elements. I was hoping these elements may be tweaked a bit before the new release, especially to catch the flavor of engagements that may span over the course of a few days, many of which are well-documented historically and would be a pleasure to design and play. As far as a "campaign" goes, I see no discernible difference between a "campaign" and an "operation" for CM purposes. A campaign where you take the same company throughout the war would be gamey and unhistorical. Take the average US rifle company in the ETO. After a week or two of fierce combat (which is what we're talking about game-wise, and not sitting around a quiet sector somewhere -- that would not be a game, that would, well, too much like the army), many rifle companies are unrecognizable messes. All the officers are dead and wounded, a few sergeants are still around, and most of your platoons are down to squad sized -- then a flush of new fresh faces arrive from the world, most of whom are blown to smithereens in the first artillery barrage. If you're an armored company, most of your tanks are destroyed, broken down, or in various states of repair. Then you go to the rear, patch up, and do it all over again, except with mostly new guys. The only troops who survive the line units from battle to battle are a few extremely lucky enlisted men, a few lucky officers, and a few shell-shocked new replacements. In fact, the more "veteran" a unit is, the most likely its nerves are to be shot -- veteran troops actually degrade and become less combat effective over time. To do a campaign "realistically", your unit would be unrecognizable after a few battles, and perhaps even worse then when it started. Not a good campaign model for game purposes -- especially if you are conditioned to think that your troops automatically get better with age. True, you might have a few vets do "medal of honor" things, but they'd get pulled off the line to sell war bonds. Also, with cross-attachment, you would rarely get a combined arms force that would hang out together for long -- after your courageous road block defense with an infantry unit and a few AT guns, the AT guns would get reassigned to division, and your outstanding lieutenant who showed great pluck leading the company might get promoted to battalion S-2, and you'd get some new schlep fresh from the world who'd get your veterans killed doing something stupid. By all means, don't put this into the game -- any realistic depiction of a "campaign" along these lines would be terrible, although accurate, exercises and a waste of programming resources. However, the "operations" concept is worth preserving, to perhaps simulate some rough fighting over a few days on some key ground. You'd be force to conserve your resources and your troops, you'd tensely wait for reinforcements, you'd hope the 2nd Armored arrived in time, and you'd hope to keep together a reserve a few tired soldiers to plug the gaps in the perimeter one last time. These sorts of battles are the grand story of small unit combat in World War 2-- a battered rifle company, tenuously holding the line, hoping it can get a few more fresh faces and supplies, and perhaps some support from the big guns, or a few more precious bazooka rockets, lest it be overrun, is great drama because its real -- and is worth preserving in the game. My two cents. Keep up the good work, Battlefront. I look forward to your product, on your time line, not mine. Frank

MeatEtr, Please don't introduce rationality into this thread. It disturbs me.

For the record, I'm still patient.

you guys are so un-naggy. I think we're being amazingly patient. Like Job or something.

I have the patience of Job. Too bad he was a dick wad.

quietly waiting. patient. patient. taking up needlepoint.

Good read. Thats why I love you geeks.

And not even being a nag about it.

Hey..they're not lowlifes. They're my peeps! Here's hoping your company is strong in the coming year, and to you guys continuing to provide us a bit of happiness! Frank

I loved making that one. Since I made it, though, I couldnt really play it! I was pretty meticulous on the research for that one. God, what a nightmarish mess that scenario is. Hopefully, its a fun nightmarish mess. F

Dear Battlefront, Hey Battlefront. Its been a while. How you holding up? You look good. Must be taking care of yourselves. I hope you get a chance to go outside once in a while. You know I haven't talked to you in about three or four years. Nothin' personal. I mean, I play all the new CM stuff, but I've kinda missing the old school stuff, if you get my drift. Don't get me wrong -- I'm all down with gratuitous invasions of middle-eastern "countries", but sheesh, its sort of like being proud of a pro NFL team tromping the high school team --- while measuring its success by how few injuries it got doing it. But I gotta say, I saw the new baby pictures for your new project, Normandy -- and gotta say, Norm looks great. I mean, I'm stunned that something so attractive can come from a bunch of people so..well..you get the idea. But anyway, I can't wait until Norm gets all its shots and gets to come out and play with us soon. As you can see..I'm kinda going nuts. Hurry up, dammit. Is there anything I can do to expedite this? You need money? You need people "taken care of"? You need some scenarios spun together? Need someone sued? Some dirty deeds done? I can be your guy. Just lemme know. I got your back. Now...where are my meds? love, Franko -- losing his mind until CM Norm comes out.

*Sniff*. How much you've grown in the last ten years. *Sniff*. Its really true...they grow up too fast. *Sniff*. I'm soooo there. Can I beta test? Can I design some scenarios? Pretty Please. I promise I'll be good.

You guys are off-the-chart silly.

I've been playing the game for some weeks now. I've downloaded all the versions. It looks pretty good to me. Granted, there's always room for improvement, which BF has always done, but I'm really not running into too many issues. Are my expectations too low? Maybe because I wasnt lurking on the forums in anticipation for a year...seriously guys, get to work designing scenarios, so we can all start having tons of fun. Waving the pom-poms for Battlefront.

My first Scenario is being designed...its called "Generation Kill". Stay tuned..

Excellent AAR. Now, I want to play it! Its been a couple of years since I designed it, so maybe I wont know any of its hidden secrets anymore. Thanks for that..CMBB is a classic.

DUDE! Please send me the AAR! I'm dying to read it! Or post it!

Look forward to hearing from you..and happy to playtest!

Well I better give the "elite" setting a whirl!

Jeez, those were some of my favorites to design, too. My favorite design, and the best response I got, was for "August Bank Holiday". Thanks for remembering!

This is what I mean. The Battlefront guys are so responsive, they get nostalgic within a New York minute (wait... Dorosh will correct me and say that it has been about TEN minutes) Frank

Hey guys. Its probably been like three years since I've posted. But, of course, I had to get CMSF. I used to love doing scenario design for old series, and even was fortunate enough to have my scenarios published in the retail release of CMBO. I have spent countless hours on the old series. I've been playing CMSF since it came out a few days ago, and I just HAVE to say..... FANTASTIC! You guys at Battlefront have outdid yourselves. Your support is unmatched, too. Well done! Bravo! I hope to be designing some stuff for the community soon.

I love that song, too. The events depicted therein happened a few clicks to the west.

Or it was named with driving the Allies into the sea in mind rather then the ease at which it would be achieved. I haven't read any of the operational orders or such Grog stuff but I can't imagine that at this stage of the war the Germans would think anything would come easy. Certainly not with a bunch of 8" cruisers and DDs off shore. </font>

Or it was named with driving the Allies into the sea in mind rather then the ease at which it would be achieved. I haven't read any of the operational orders or such Grog stuff but I can't imagine that at this stage of the war the Germans would think anything would come easy. Certainly not with a bunch of 8" cruisers and DDs off shore. [/QB]