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Gun depression wont be modeled in CM2 either I believe. I had asked that it be abstracted into the new Hull Down command. The abstraction being the better the gun depression, the more likely HD status is reached. BTS never responded. Lewis

It would also be nice if troops would just autorotate when you give the arc.

I noticed this also. Its as if the units dont regard the bocage itself as cover and "rush" towards the enemy because thats where the closest cover is. Same thing with wire i believe. hopefully bocage will be out for CM2.

This is going to be cool. Imagine setting up a U shaped ambush and having an enemy waltz into the middle. He will trip off ambush fire if he goes left or right. Will all heights be targetted?

It will also have a limited life. Ambush markers are out for CM2 and covered arcs are in. But the covered arcs also might have a range function also.

Ponderous. Since I am double-secret probation, please leave me out of this thread. Lewis

I didnt really care if there were Nisei or Afro-American TD units. I just wanted to demonstrate that Slap would go into his "history of black troops" mode. Didnt say a damn thing about the Nisei. Its like pushing a button and he's full of stories about black troops fighting without pieces of their bodies and supplying excuses for any less than heroic behaviour. Not that I give a damn about this either but how much CAN leadership matter in a towed AT unit? Its a rather defensive mission. But I am sure theres all kinds of ref's and reports and citations about it. Thanks Slap for proving my point. Enjoy work tonight. Lewis PS If any person here takes offense at this. You are getting it wrong.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: It is also worth noting that TD command training was much better than AGF command for tankers, and many TD units were considered elite, and should be at least veteran in the game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Were there any Nisei or Afro-American Tank Destroyer units Slappy?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kampfgruppe_Commander: Pity your knowledge of Pong is also your basis for those tough tactical questions...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I guess I also picked up a few tactical answers in the service. Uh, which service were you in? From your pic in your bio, one that wears cheap wool nazi uniforms I guess.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by c3k: Guys, girls, and others, Let's get this gyrostabilizer thing straight. Yes, some Shermans were equipped with them. All the gyro was able to do was correct the height adjustment of the barrel. In other words, it kept the barrel at the same elevetion regardless of terrain undulations as the tank moved. Any longitudinal (side to side) adjustment still had to be done by the gunner. Let's think about this for a minute. If the gyro tank is moving perpendicular to the target, the gunner has a continuously changing lead angle to compute. Odds of hitting? Not very good. Usefullness of previous rounds for next round corrections? Not very. Okay, remove that tangential movement by having the gyro tank moving directly towards the target. With a continuously shortening range, what good does a fixed gun elevation do? Not much.' Okay, now let's put yourself in the tank. You've got the gyro engaged (not very likely since this assumes that the gyro worked upon delivery, has been adjusted in the field, spare parts are on hand, the crew is trained in its use, and it hasn't broken down lately). Now, you're in the turret with the 75mm gun. The tank is ripping across some field, bouncing up and down. You're bracing yourself as best you can. What's that damn gun doing just inches from your head and chest? Well, it's breech is swinging up and down as violently, if not more so, than the tank. Me, (as well as many actual crews according to unit hisories), would just disconnect the damn thing before it kills me. Ken "unstable at the moment" McManamy<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Theres some info you are missing. Crews that used them would use the coax 30 cal as an indicator. A 1940's laser if you will. As the 30 cals started to strike the enemy tank, the commander would order the fire. So for the 76mm sherman, whose main gun velocity closely matched the 30 cal, this could be used out to 5-800 meter range. The 75mm was probably shorter. This took experience. It took gyros dialed in. If the russians used them on shermans, who knows. Lewis

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Fred: Gen, Lusername is well known for his attitude to take EVERY bait and start a flame war. The ONLY reason that this guy is not banned is, from time to time, he acts like a consent being. And yes, this is the price of doing business Fred<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> So thats the story. People bait me and its a reaction on my part? Here I was thinking it was soemthing I was doing.. Fred, for a guy that has such a low member number, errrrr, do you have any bit of a clue whats going on? Lewis

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gunnergoz: From my recollection of numerous WW2 readings, I feel safe in saying that firing from the move was done in WW2 but it was not expected to hit much except at very close range. It was much more common to shoot at a moving target, however, and most if not all tank sight reticules have provision for leading a target at different ranges. The gyrostabilizer on the Sherman series was often disconnected by the users as it didn't seem to accomplish much for them. It was stabilized in elevation only and so would only be useful if one was advancing on a target which was directly in front of the tank. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This has been discussed before and you are probably right. As a control engineer, let me say that without good sensors, digital electronics, etc, this technology would not work very well in a vibrational nightmare like a tank. It would most likely be good for spraying the coax MG at treelines, hitting barns with HE from a couple hundred yards max. The main problem is drift and adjustment. On a big massive object like a battleship, with slow rolling waves, it would be adequate servo technology. In a shake box like a tank its a service nightmare. Its main drawback is the correction-lagging in that its response to a change is not fast enough before the next reversal of motion kicks in. Its always behind the ball. A real advantage might be that it would set up the shot so that when the tank stopped, it was already lined up and quick minor adjustments could attain a hit. The sherman actually was a cadillac compared to T34s and other tanks with steel tracks. The rubber tracks and rubber rimmed wheels of the shermans were better than most. On a road, driving slow, firing at a target directly ahead of it, it might have been able to fire AP better than most other tanks on the move. But so what, it was moving directly at the target. lewis

08:26 AM 11:32 AM 11:36 AM 12:11 PM 12:13 PM 12:32 PM 01:34 PM 01:50 PM Lunch Claim So you lunch for two hours? Must be nice. Well, we will miss you tonight cause you wont be in the Library will you?

Slopdraggin is now posting with refs!!!!! He should be the topic of one of those daytime talk shows "Stop me before I post again!". Hope your boss is satsfied with you. Just to defend myself, I am not collecting welfare OR unemployment (yet). I was given a severance of 4 weeks, had a vacation check and theres a waiting week on top of all this before I could collect unemployment. So there we have Sloppy saying typically insulting things based on assumptions. And assumptions and prejudgice go hand in hand. He insulted Chinese people. Insinuated that all Chinese restAUrants (I hope he knows that restaurants in China are not chinese restaurants, they are just restaurants) serve cats and other stuff. This is an insult to Chinese restaurants in the US and Chinese people. He then assumes that just because my wife is Asian, that she could possibly know what Chinese people eat (In restaurants in China). He is becoming the poster boy for the ugly american. He then trys to cover it up because he saw a guy do it. He won't address the issue and now it appears he is some kind of online-aholic that can't stop posting at work (federally paid too). If he apologizes again to me (he has previously accused me of being racist and some other things and rescinded), then I will drop this. Lewis

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: By the way, its lunch here (even Federal Employees get that -- not all of us are happy living all day off of uncle sam like yourself ) but I do post from time to time. I usually type about a hundred words a minute, but never spell check because I don't have all day such like you do to reread things. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Time to time? How many times today? 8 or 9? In this thread alone? How much surfing research and shopping to go along with that? Should fed workers get faster connections in the faint hope that they may get SOME work done? Get to work. Lewis

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: By the way, can you tell me what is happening on "Days of Our Lives" recently, I rarely get a chance to see it, and I know have the chance now.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You rarely post without a misspelling or some kind of error("I know have the chance now"? Nothing like trying to come off flippant and funny and posting oddly on the punch line). I guess it’s those crappy synapse’s getting ready to go haywire huh? You don’t seem to let your day job interfere with your posting practices. Very professional. More tax dollars up in smoke. Well, I am going to drop this. I got my satisfaction out of exposing you. You go around accusing people of being things and then demonstrate that you are exactly what you accuse others of being. Lewis

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: In fact, if you read Lewis any, this is exactly what the "attack BTS" gang does to derail conversations. I really was only playing with Lewis, not arguing any point. .<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I think its apparent what you are doing now. You arent man enough to apologize. Its part of your poor character. So what do you do? You try to deflect the point. Maybe being around court rooms has twisted you further. "Attack/hate BTS"? Thats the best you can come up with? You really come off as someone with no dignity. Lewis

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: Scipio, it is not up to Geier to prove you wrong, it is up to you to prove that he is wrong. As to the side issue of cats in chinese eateries, I am through poking fun at Lewis, so I will let it drop. I wouldn't want to delay his coding for his new "better than CM" game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> What a laugh. There you go again pontificating about right ang wrong and proving stuff (funny cause you stare at it through a camera). First you go calling me a racist and then you make a racially charged slur. You just poked yourself in front of everyone. You are a Hypocrite. Lewis PS If you cant stand the heat then get out of the Chinese kitchen.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by MrSpkr: Hey! Leave us southerners out of your prepubescent little catfight.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Just making a point. See how charged a remark like that seems to you? Well the same can be said about Slappys "humor". For some reason, people believe its OK to make fun of Asians. Suppose someone said "Evolution is slow" and I replied "Evolution is as slow as a southerner reading War and Peace outloud with a mouth full of mollassas." How would you feel? As for my wifes country of origion, why is that of any concern? I dont care about your wives, girlfriends, boyfriends, etc. Lewis [ 07-24-2001: Message edited by: Username ]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: I will admit this, you are the easiest person to manipulate in the world Lewis. ?)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Lets just apply a little Slappisms to the subject. In your posturing as a statistically driven researcher, you give advice such as (example here, gyros): 1) a substantial body of evidence on how US gyros worked 2) better firing range tests using a generic battlefield that isolated your variables Well, do you have similar data about the consumption of cats in ALL chinese restaurants? Do you feel comfortable from basing everything about Chinese about your limited time around your friend? I would say in the United States, Cat is not either on the menu or served at home mostly. Why would my wife know anything about what chinese eat? I said she was Asian. You, with your prejugding, assume she is Chinese because she is Asian? You are from down south US arent you? It shows. But keep trying to deflect the issue with trite stinky fish stories. I think people see you as you are. Lewis

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: Yeah, and my former office mate Youhda Zu ate cat you narrow minded pimple, I watched him prepare the damn thing myself. You assume every Chinese Resteraunt is run by Han Chinese and that no Chinese person eats cat, dog, pigeon, snake, or whatever. Seems like your wife's race is immaterial since you never asked her what is eaten in China or if different parts of the country eat different things. .<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> OK so you saw one cat prepared. Now that allows you to make a remark about all chinese restaurants? If someone said "Sherman tanks last as long as watermelons in a soul food restaurant", would that be taken as broad mindedly? Of course not, its a stupid insensititive thing to say and you did say something completely analogous. Sorry slappy you got busted and arent man enough to admit it. You made a comment against chinese restaurants and then back it up with a narrow minded anectode. You try to come off so above it all and then its shown what you are really made of. Lewis PS Oh is your big career filming court TV now?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: You assume every Chinese Resteraunt is run by Han Chinese and that no Chinese person eats cat, dog, pigeon, snake, or whatever. Besides, I accused you of being ignorant, ....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Ignorant of what, how to spell restaurant? You sure you are qualified to teach at any level? You are a blight on the institution you teach at.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: Shermans die faster than cats in a chinese resteraunt.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This is funny. Not for its intended humor but coming from a person that accuses others of being racist, sexist, whatever. My wife is Asian you cluck.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: Anyone miss me yet? Well, it is nice to see BTS weigh in, and I guess all that is left to say, is that I too look forward to seeing CM2. Hello to all the CMer's out their still in the comfort of their own homes and not trapped at a hallway internet stand in an Army dorm. I am playing unmodded CM on my laptop when I get the chance. It's not as bad as it sounds....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Oh please already. When I was in the service we didnt have any hallway internet stands. In fact, there wasnt any internet either. we played pong on TV and we liked it dammit! Unmodded CM on a laptop. War is hell huh? Canadian weekend warriors make me ill. Lewis

Lewis quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1. Is there a single 'roll' for an instant in time when multiple mixed unit types are trying to spot an enemy in LOS? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve sez: Sortof. As I said before, I didn't remember exactly how it works so I asked charles. Basically, the highest spotting value "wins". For example, various spottings of a single Enemy unit over time... Unit A spots Enemy unit with value 10 - Enemy unit's spot value goes to 10. Unit B spots Enemy unit with value 20 - Enemy unit's spot value goes to 20. Unit C spots Enemy unit with value 10 - Enemy unit's spot value remains at 20. The current spotting value determines what the friendly side gets to see/know about the Enemy unit. Each x seconds every unit's spotting value is knocked down (dunno how much or how often). This means that there has to be a continual spotting of the Enemy unit to keep it marked on the map. So assuming the Enemy unit cited above loses 10 spotting points, and the next friendly unit spots at 20, then the new value is 20. If no friendly units spot, or spot weaker than 10, then 10 is the number. This is how units can disappear off the map. However, when they reappear they do so at the highest level of Intelligence that it was last indexed to. This is not something that can be changed effectively until we move to Relative Spotting (i.e. downgrading Intel). Steve Well considering the stripping of info taking place and the "gang spotting" going on, may I suggest the following? 1. First unit spots target, spot goes to 10 2. Second unit spots target with 20, average (10+20)/2=15 3. Third unit spots with 25. average(25+15)/2=20 This cant be beyond coding to do a running average type update. The info is still on the spottee side and impact to the game engine is minimal. In the case of vehicles, it would still allow the spotting of vehicles but not the glut of vehicle info. Lewis [ 07-21-2001: Message edited by: Username ]