Own made QB map question

[Jorges]

Hello.

As a former SimCity player I really enjoy the map editor. Easy to use and very fun with so much to do, all the terrain types, decorations etc.

Now comes the part that former SimCity player can't understand I made Tiny QB map and added the objective rewarded 1000 pts. When I play the map nothing happens from the AIs side. Need to add some AI plans with the editor? Do I also have to purchase AI troops with the editor for the QB map? Hope not... You don't have to start teaching me but some direction for a noob would be highly appreciated.

I read the manual and really respect it, true story. Just couldn't figure this out...

Thank you.

-Jorges

[LarsS]

I agree with regard to the editor. It kicks behind! I have spent untold hours just building stuff for CMSF and will do the same for BN.

For the AI to do anything in any scenario on any map, it needs AI plans. Otherwise its units will remain in their starting positions and do nothing. Well, they will shoot at you if they see you, and the TacAI might move them some, but nothing aside from that. Making AI plans is actually quite easy. Making good AI plans can be a little trickier. If I were you, I would start by opening a QB map in the editor and just look at how the map's designer has handled the AI plans. And start small when tinkering in the editor. The principle for AI plans is the same for a single squad and a full battalion. And re-read the important parts for scenario creation in the manual; especially the bit about the "exit before" and "exit after" AI plan orders. They control when and how the AI will move its forces in battle.

[Sgt Schultz]

Each QB map needs at least one generic plan for each side.

It appears more difficult than it is. Once you climb the learning curve, it is smooth sailing and lots of testing with scenario author mode.

Make setup zones and a few generic advance/active orders for 2 Groups for each side.

Purchase units for each side.

Save.

Go to 'Battle' choice at front screen.

Choose your battle.

Select 1 player turn-based, scenario author option.

Watch what the other side does with your plan and random units.

------

I was in your shoes just a few weeks ago. Thinking I would whip out a few quick QB maps and be on my way.

Wrong.

Make a small scenario to get the hang of how the TacAI and your plans work together with units on the field. It will make a HUGE difference in the quality of any future QB maps you may choose to make.

[mjkerner]

It appears more difficult than it is. Once you climb the learning curve, it is smooth sailing and lots of testing with scenario author mode.

You got that right, Sarge. I let the AI plan process stymie me for the whole time I played CMSF because it seemed hard to grasp, so I never really tried. I just made maps and full scenarios. But I really wasn't going to let that happen with this game, so starting meessing with it last week and I can't believe how really easy it is to deal with AI plans. And fun to watch them play out (sort of, enemy and environmental factors notwithstanding) as planned.

[Jorges]

Hi.

Thank you all very much. So, much to learn but it's fun when it's fun.

"LarsS: If I were you, I would start by opening a QB map in the editor and just look at how the map's designer has handled the AI plans. And start small when tinkering in the editor."

This sounds like a good idea. Might be a good way to start.

Cheers.

[General_solomon]

ok guys, don't forget to share you scenarios with the rest of us. i am very artistic and do appreciate those here that can put together these battles.

many thanks to all the map makers.

[Cull]

I'm starting to get the hang of AI plans and whatnot, but here's my question for veteran map-makers:

When designing AI plans, how do you account for what random units might show up when a player loads your map for a QB?

In other words, I may design AI plans with the general composition of the groups in mind, but the forces may be entirely different on any given play, rendering my carefully-laid AI plans....silly.

In other words, I can design a map and AI plans that would make for a great infantry fight, but what happens when a bunch of armor shows up for the battle?

The answer seems obvious: you can't account for it. So is the answer just to make your designs quite "generic" and hope for the best?

[mjkerner]

Cull, I went through the same thought process and concern as I started to figure out AI plans. I think you answered your own question. A map good for infantry probably isn't good for tanks, but if the player wants tanks, wwell, things might get goofy. So I decided on more generic plans. OTOH, I get fairly specigfic with set up areas. I don't want infantry starting out in the middle of fields, say, so I will make that zone along the hedgrows. If tanks go in there, well, then they're lined up all ready to start blasting away through the hedge, I guess. But then the AI would path them as it saw fit to get to the next map zone.

Anyway, I plan on just forewarnig players that this map may not be armor friendly, if that was the case.

[Cull]

Thanks mj. Accepting that "limitation" of the design process helps me move forward.

I guess in the end a well-designed map is one where the designer has accounted for the variables of the QB system---and tried to limit opportunities for "silly" situations---to the greatest extent possible.

And making full use of the designer notes is a good idea; offering recommendations to the player (even down to unit types) will help limit "bad experiences".

I've started a new map and I'm going to set up 2-3 simple plans---with no more than say, 3 orders per group---for each side, followed by copious testing. I think that'll give me a better feel for the full range of "what might happen", then I can go from there.