Building Damage criteria

[Erwin]

Many of the NATO missions require you to not damage objective area buildings. However, how much damage does that mean?

I have successfully run "Light Munition" helicopter missions repeatedly (6+ times) over the same objective area buildings as well as 60mm ("Personnel") mortars. 25mm and 30mm guns have fired at the same buildings. And I still get the VP credits.

I have not tried 81mm or larger mortars/arty or tank guns, but am wondering how much abuse one can get away with.

Does a building in the objective area have to be demolished - or have visible scars/damage to make one lose VP's? Does more than one building have to be abused in this way?

[jnt62006]

From my experience its only when the building collapses that you lose the points. Usually a couple bursts of M19 or one or two tank rounds will bring a building down, though like everything else it varies. Anything smaller than a 50 cal will not bring a building down. I cant remember seeing one come down with 25mm or 30mm but I could be wrong. But I suppose it would depend. A 30mm gun run from an A10 (depleted uranium rounds fired from a minigun) can lay down a lot more hurt than an AH-64 chain gun. Anything arty (105+) will bring one down.

[gibsonm]

Bradley / LAV 25mm fire can "destroy" a building after a few turns / minutes.

[Erwin]

If actual destruction of a building is what loses points, one can restrict the amount of 25mm-30mm fire onto any one building. I have been doing that for several missions now (as well as using 60mm mortars and helicopters on built-up areas for many turns in a game). So long as everything is set for "light" and "personnel" type of munitions, damage to buildings seems minimal. It seems to be a successful method of keeping enemy heads down until one's inf can get into position.

In mission 2 of the Canadian Campaign, it seems very difficult/almost impossible to get vehicles across the river unharmed due to IED's. So, I left them on the starting side while the inf go on alone, with only helicopter and 60mm support in the "protected areas." Of course I use 155mm and heavy airstrikes on other buildings.

Not realistic, but it's just a game. As someone said: "Of course in real life you would not do that... but if the game limits you in one area, exploit it in another."

So, far only a couple casualties.

[gibsonm]

So long as everything is set for "light" and "personnel" type of munitions, damage to buildings seems minimal. It seems to be a successful method of keeping enemy heads down until one's inf can get into position.

You are aware no doubt that using "Target Light" for vehicle weapons means fundamentally no main armament.

So for a LAV that means no 25mm but only coax.

I can't recall of hand though for Bradley if it means no TOW but 25mm and coax or no TOW, no 25mm and only coax.

[akd]

You are aware no doubt that using "Target Light" for vehicle weapons means fundamentally no main armament.

So for a LAV that means no 25mm but only coax.

I can't recall of hand though for Bradley if it means no TOW but 25mm and coax or no TOW, no 25mm and only coax.

Depends on the vehicle and the "no main weapon" dynamic only works if there are only two weapons: cannon and coax. Bradleys, BMPs,, Marders etc. will all use their main guns against buildings with a target light command.

[DaveDash]

It is definitely not the actual building destroyed. If you hit it with a Javelin but it is still intact you will lose points.

[MeatEtr]

Yeah you definitely do not have to bring a building down to lose preserve points for it. All you need to do is visible damage to a building, ie. a blown wall or collapsed roof.

[Erwin]

gibsonm: I did use TARGET for vehicles with 25mm-30mm, so they were firing max. But, I restrict them (with movement orders that re-establish target arc) so they cease firing after maybe 15-30 secs (depending on how many AFV's are firing at the same target/building at the same time).

The trick is to ensure that the total number of HE rounds fired is less than the "one vehicle firing to 2-3 minutes which would create visible damage or bring the building down."

I presume that the trigger to lose points would be if a building wall was demolished(?)

[DaveDash]

Its not even a wall. In the Task Force Thunder mission 'Normandy' I got zero points for the water pump building and the other one after my guys fired Javelins at them, yet all the walls remained intact (there was no visible damage or crumpling sound).

[Jonny(FGM)]

Here's the results of a quick test

All buildings were worth 100pts each for preserve

1 has a blown out wall

2 took some 25mm rounds to its front but not blown out walls

3 Has the roof caved in

4 is totally destroyed

[Jonny(FGM)]

I'll run another test tomorrow where the preserve zones encompass multiple buildings unless someone beats me to it

[Erwin]

Well, I accidentally demolished a wall of a building in the "green zone" and after saving and cease-firing to see what the result was I STILL got the bonus points for no damage to the protected zone buildings.

Is this a sensitivity thing that a designer can select?

Jonny: It may be that when there are a LOT of buildings, getting one wall demolished may not be a critical thing???