How to use the M1127 effectivly ?

[Pete Wenman]

Guys hi

I'm putting together a scenario on the large rural map I posted in the design forum,with the intention of having US forces push forward with recce units (all that's on map for the first couple of turns).

However they are being taken out as they spot the enemy units (LRATGM). Is there any way to move a large vehicle into a cover position without it being seen by the defender.

Given the lack of RWS on the M1127 its role is more to do with observing than fighting. I guess in WEGO the lack of ability to move forward observe for say 15 seconds then pull back is a problem, as is the lack of moving to hull down positions without micro management.

So given the above how are these vehicles best used within the game ?

[birdstrike]

Hm, the only two things I can see working here are range and concealment. I have no idea about the effectiveness of the latter one, but as foliage does influence LOS, it may work.

On the other hand, I'd think that range is a more important factor. I could imagine in RL these vehicles s are not ideally used at ranges of only a few 100m. They should shine much more at distances in the km range.

[Cpl Steiner]

I had a similar idea so I read the online ISR Chapter (INTELLIGENCE, SURVEILLANCE, AND

RECONNAISSANCE) of the SBCT Infantry Battalion field manual.

Here's a pic from the manual showing how the brigade Cavalry Squadron leads the way and hands off recon targets to follow-on battalion recon platoons, which also provide overwatch for the brigade squadron.

The chapter also suggest augmenting recon units with sniper, fire support and Javelin teams, and limiting recon to areas in range of friendly artillery support.

I guess the basic idea is to avoid a direct firefight if possible, or kill the threat with supporting fires if not.

Oh, and one more thing I forgot. I read somewhere else (can't remember where) that the RV is supposed to pull up in concealment short of an enemy location and dismount the recon team for direct observation of the enemy position. The RV is not supposed to be in view of the enemy for any length of time. The dismounted recon team can more easily get to an observation position undetected.

[ August 29, 2007, 02:09 AM: Message edited by: Cpl Steiner ]

[lrrprecon]

Well i guess if the VEH has no Weapon platform and uses a LRAS, its main job is for RECON for a larger force. But in all reality from what i have seen from my tour in Iraq, my troop utilized our Scouts, but in Iraq we are not utilizing RECON Doctrine. We go from house to house on searches and raids, bounce faces off the blacklist for our AO, ask questions and track down who is hiding weapons and explosives, find the cache's, dig em up and blow them up. Or we drive around till we get blown up, while on our patrols. I kinda felt like a cop on his beat, just going around and keeping the peace and what not.

[Sixxkiller]

This game isnt meant to simulate occupation. The ROE is much better in CMSF.

[birdstrike]

Does anyone know how detailed the game models hull-down in relation to the 3d model?

i.e. whether the game takes into consideration if only the sensor system is exposed above a crest?

[lrrprecon]

Originally posted by birdstrike:

Does anyone know how detailed the game models hull-down in relation to the 3d model?

i.e. whether the game takes into consideration if only the sensor system is exposed above a crest?

Bird i have seen no tactical advantage with being hull down in game. It really depends on your Gunners accuracy and Bonuses. I'm not sure of the specifics in calculation and what not. I remember on the first map of the Campaign, i was behind the Berm and shooting through the Berm resulting in kills on the hull-down T-54/55 MBT's. But i really haven't used much of hull down at all, i use buildings as a barrier and creep my Strykers out a bit just to get shots on INF in the open. Thats the closest i ever get to being hull down. Granted its not really being "Hull Down" a M1A2 SEP hull down would be devistating though!

[birdstrike]

Thanks, Irrprecon, but I'm afraid I didn't make myself clear, sorry.

I know there is a "general" hull down bonus, with the terrain obstructing the LOF - with varying effectiveness

but I was wondering how detailed the hull down in relation to the 3D model of the vehicle is calculated.

For the particular case of RVs with the sensor turret on top, like the M707 Humvee, when only the turret is exposed in 3D view, does the game really treat the unit as if only the sensors are visible/can be damaged/can detect the enemy or do we need to expose an actual part of vehicle itself to have any such effect game-wise.