ToW as 3D Close Combat

[z1812]

Hi All,

I had not played ToW for quite a time. Then I downloaded the Uber patch and JSI mod.

I am finding it to be quite a bit of fun creating small scenarios with the Battle Generator.

I allow no more than 15 units per side which I find quite managable. Usually it ends up as less.

I try to make them historical, but only in the sense that the Germans have less units but more experience.

Too bad about non-enterable buildings and no smoke. However, at least I am enjoying the game when I thought I may never do so.

Try it you may enjoy it too.

regards John

[crazyman56]

Hey i love making small squad based battles as well with toW you do get a bit over enthralled in my experience. eg. spending all day playing one campaign.

[SlapHappy]

Well, if you do the math, you'll find that the unit total limits are pretty much the same as close combat. In close combat you had a 15 squad/vehicle limit.

In TOW you have a 200 individual soldier/vehicle limit (or thereabouts) 9 man squads x 15 = 135 soldiers per side. If you throw in 3 vehicles per side this becomes 9 x 12 = 108 soldiers + 3 vehicles = 111 per side.

One difference, of course, was that CC maps were about 500 meters per side max (without modding). That's about 4x smaller than TOW maps. I used to think CC maps were WAY too small, but after doing some research concerning unit frontages in WWII, I found that perhaps they were closer to the mark than I had originally realized.

One problem with the larger TOW map capability, is that it becomes difficult to include as many terrain features as one might like using the full 2048 x 2048 maps. The engine just can't handle it without crashing. This also plays into the problem (IMO) that the lethality of small arms is just too high at some of the ranges you can fight at in a TOW battle.

That's part of the reason I think Nikki had the right idea with his smaller defensive map that he stuffed full of cover items and buildings and prepared positions. see: Topic: Fortresses and filling the built area void.

I don't want to play a scenario where 90% of the squads are chopped up in a few minutes before I even have a chance to get into the game. Granted, lack of smoke and non-enterable buildings is a big part of this problem. Easy LOS and lethality levels make playing a typical TOW scenario a real meat-grinder for infantry the way things stand. AI issues don't help much, either.

I'd still like to address some of these issues with a personal mod, but not until I have some idea when (or if) any add-on might change the balance on the battlefield and make the whole effort pointless.

[ June 10, 2008, 05:01 PM: Message edited by: SlapHappy ]

[pad152]

Tow is best at small squad level battles, there is just no way to manage the number of squads in medium to large CC type battles. There just needs to be a better way to manage infantry ammo in Tow (stop shooting at tanks).

Tow you manage men

CC you manage squads

[Gnasher]

Some very interesting & valid points gents.

[RobboG]

Have to agree with pad152. The larger missions and campaigns are very difficult to manage because of the amount of units and the vast scale of the maps. Small squad level battles is where TOW really shines. Now if only I could work out how to stop the AI player from running away when I create a small battle.

[Reichenberg]

Originally posted by RobboG:

....Now if only I could work out how to stop the AI player from running away when I create a small battle.

That's a really cheesy way of showing off how amazing your skill is

Uwe