Best Cover ???

[Lanzfeld]

I downloaded the demo and I am having a great time. I keep replaying "Going To Town" to try different things and to learn the new system.

Cover is a big mystery so far. I read in the forums that roof tops are bad (even though some have that big thick wall on top... seems the same as being inside shooting out and down but whatever) and I also read that balconies are bad (how the hell do I keep the fools OFF those overhangs!!!).

What I am wondering is how are we to figure out the good cover without the nice exposure percentage from CM1? Are all the buildings the same? Are woods any good (as they were in CM1)??? I guess not too many woods in the desert but there are some trees in the game....are those woods? Is it better to be inside a small house or to be around the few trees outside the house??? Manual not too much help here.

P.S. The fifty Cal seems a little weak to me. Spraying buildings with troops inside I know those big half inch rounds are going through but not too much damage to the girls inside it seems. Still VERY impressed by this game.

[Secondbrooks]

I don't know this sceanrio, it's not in full version. Or atleast i havent' noticed it.

House, trench and woods, others aren't proving much cover in 1.05. I don't know has values been tweaked more in later versions, but this was somewhat tested by forum members with 1.05 (or was it 1.04?). This is with smallarms fire.

I would say that you should use house or trench (i usually favor house over trench). Woods are douple-sided sword, your in cover and in concealment but you might not see much from there. There's difference with tree types, palm and pine (i quess it's a pine) doesn't much block the visibility. Unlike some trees which leaves (almost) touches ground your men might not see anything if not stationed just next to open space. Placing squad in middle of 3 trees isn't much doing anything good. You should have tens of meters pine trees in between to make use of forest actually fruitful idea. remember that this game is showing things in 1:1 scale and it performs like that too. So: if there is one tree, then there is just one tree and nothing more.

There are few issues. Forexample if you fear enemy RPG's or other blowing stuff (as you should be) then using (pine or palm) forest is good idea. ordinance might blow-up in trees before they reach your men, fot this i recommend atleast 60 meters of forest, close distances and forest might turn against you (shells blowing in top of men, slaugther this is)... Ofcourse same applies to your men: It's not best AT-tactic in CMSF to put AT-units deep inside forest, as their spare RPG-ammo might hit trees. Problem is that there usually isn't "optimal" forest in use. It's very much likely that one uses forests in wrong way. Like: your men can't shoot opfor before it reaches forest and now they are hard thing to kill (you put them too deep, they can't see or fire to open) or your men gets almost zero protective effect from forest (you put them too close to forest's edge)

CMSF has been said to requires much more learning than CMx1... I agree. Forgetting CMx1's 'set of rules' seems to be good advice.

[Cpl Steiner]

Originally posted by Lanzfeld:

What I am wondering is how are we to figure out the good cover without the nice exposure percentage from CM1?

Since v1.07 I find low walls are pretty good. You can order your men to hide behind them and they are pretty much immune to direct fire. You can then order them to unhide briefly, and they will go from prone to kneeling and start spotting targets and engaging them over the wall. As soon as they start taking heavy return fire I just order them to hide again.

Actually the same is true of trenches now also.

[Lanzfeld]

Does anyone know if all buildings give the same cover?

[Secondbrooks]

Originally posted by Cpl Steiner:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Lanzfeld:

What I am wondering is how are we to figure out the good cover without the nice exposure percentage from CM1?

Since v1.07 I find low walls are pretty good. You can order your men to hide behind them and they are pretty much immune to direct fire. You can then order them to unhide briefly, and they will go from prone to kneeling and start spotting targets and engaging them over the wall. As soon as they start taking heavy return fire I just order them to hide again.

Actually the same is true of trenches now also. </font>

[Cpl Steiner]

Here's a "quicky" scenario that shows wall cover very nicely. I didn't even add a briefing or victory conditions so don't expect much!

Afghan Ambush

You are attacked from the right by some Talibs in an irrigation ditch covered by foliage and have to order your men to leap over a low rural wall and return fire. If you order the men to hide behind the wall they are pretty safe whilst you call in some light mortar fire.

[MikeyD]

'Best' cover is definitely terrain. Not a specific terrain type but generic ground undulations. I'd rather be behind a low hill than a low wall any day. Trees do have an ability to stop incoming rounds (if you're lucky). I've saved more than one tank after an incoming round hit an intervening tree. But most stuff like tall grass, bushes & trees etc. are better for 'concealment' than 'cover'.

[Field Marshal Blücher]

One thing to watch out for when taking cover in buildings is that your men are extremely vulnerable to RPGs.

[kevinkins]

In my experiance I agree with the last two posts. The weapons are lethal and cover is used for concealment until you have the firepower ready to cover the area around you after you exposed your troops to possible enemy fire. I think this is why many seemly small/short scenarios have/need longer play times.

Kevin

[YankeeDog]

Agreed. Now that they've added the 1m "sub action spots", and fixed the bug that made bullets able to cut through the tops of crests and trench edges, the best cover by far is defilade.

Buildings are pretty good, especially first floor, but only against small arms. They're also apparently going to get a bit better in v1.08, specifically against short-range small arms fire,, which the addition of high-velocity bullet shatter modeling.

But anything 12.7mm or larger will kick your ass in a building. Buildings also often have the problem of limited egress options. So it can be hard to find a covered route out if it gets too hot. Defilade positions usually offer you the option of breaking contact by just pulling back a few meters.

Cheers,

YD