Michael Emrys Posted August 11, 2002 Share Posted August 11, 2002 Originally posted by Determinant: Michael, I'm sorry - I have thought long and hard about this (sad I know - I have no life) and it is impossible.Oh well, I tried. For my part though, I've seen so many "impossible" things happen in my life that I am extremely reluctant to use the word. Michael [ August 11, 2002, 10:18 AM: Message edited by: Michael emrys ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Determinant Posted August 11, 2002 Share Posted August 11, 2002 Originally posted by Michael emrys: For my part though, I've seen so many "impossible" things happen in my life that I am extremely reluctant to use the word. MichaelAh, well, for my part being only half way through (inshallah) my life I have seen some shocking things but never an impossible thing. I envy you, Sir! I have though heard some very tall tales from soldiers. They can go like fishermen in that respect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted August 11, 2002 Share Posted August 11, 2002 Originally posted by Determinant: I have though heard some very tall tales from soldiers. They can go like fishermen in that respect...Of a certainty! It's always a good idea to place any eyewitness account into a larger context. A lot of times I have to make an estimate of what is credible and what is "unproven". And of course, my own guess could be off. But to do otherwise is to enter a hall of mirrors without any clue. One of my most irritating pet peeves is the newby who has read a single account of some action and then proceeds to quote it as if it were holy writ. When challenged, he then draws himself up sanctimoniously and pronounces, "Well, so-and-so said it was thus and so, and since he was there and you weren't, I think I'll take his word for it." This last delivered with a suspicious squint. Of course he is utterly convinced he's got you there! His position is unassailable...or so he believes. Ignorance is bliss... Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Dog Posted August 12, 2002 Share Posted August 12, 2002 Originally posted by Determinant: A round of buckshot delivers nine(ish) balls each of about .38 calibre. The shot distribution pattern will be similar to birdshot - the physics are the same. Birdshot will deliver a denser spread - more, smaller shot but the pattern is the same. I have heard of people shooting wild fowl bringing down two or three birds with a shot but seven? Just wanted to point out that combat shotguns are often equiped with a duck-bill choke, which gives the pellet spread a much more horizontal pattern. Taking this into concideration, hitting multiple man-sized target's becomes much more likely. But 14 is still a bit unbelievable... I used to own a Mossberg 500 with a duck-bill choke and a bayonet on it (x-girlfriend's father was a gunsmith and he fixed it up for me as a Xmas gift). Unfortunately, I was realy desperate for money a few years back and had to sell it. It was the perfect home defense gun... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btm Posted August 12, 2002 Share Posted August 12, 2002 Originally posted by Red Dog: Just wanted to point out that combat shotguns are often equiped with a duck-bill choke, which gives the pellet spread a much more horizontal pattern. That may be true of later combat shotguns, but not of WW2 shotguns. All of the World War 2 "Trench" and "Riot" type shotguns were full bore (no choke at all) (source: U.S. Standard Ordnance Catalog, Vol 3., 1945). Thus the spread was greater than most sporting type shotguns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted August 13, 2002 Share Posted August 13, 2002 Originally posted by mike the wino: My brother and I were at a gun show '93-'94ish and saw an interesting shotgun. When we asked about we were informed that it was a military shotgun, Remington I think. I made some comment about it being Vietnam era and was promptly corrected by the gun-grog that it was a WW2 shotgun. After a lengthy discourse, with much nodding on my part and "oh reaally"'s and "umm-huh"'s, I got a rather complete run-down on shotguns and there place in the military. As this was a while ago I remember little save this: their use dated back to at least WW1, definitely used in WW2 and Vietnam. Still wish I would have bought that gun. It had a proctetive, ventilated metal piece over the barrel so you would burn yourself on the hot barrel. Very cool looking. BTW, pump action.You must mean the Remington M1897 "Trench Gun" Here's a link for a original one on sale Shotgun with a bayonet...Nothing says close combat quite like that... Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreasyPig Posted August 14, 2002 Share Posted August 14, 2002 Red Dog, I'm trying to find more info on the "duckbill choke" after reading you post. I've always thought of it as looks cool, sounds cool, but totally a myth. I can see how you MIGHT/MAYBE be able to squash a shot pattern with the result being a denser horizontal shape. But I can't really see it "spreading" the the shot wider at a givin distance. You have any info to the contrary? Too bad you sold it. It would have been neat to see a test pattern. GreasyPig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted August 14, 2002 Share Posted August 14, 2002 Originally posted by Gyrene:You must mean the Remington M1897 "Trench Gun" Here's a link for a original one on sale Shotgun with a bayonet...Nothing says close combat quite like that... GyreneExcept maybe cracked fingernails on top of it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted August 14, 2002 Share Posted August 14, 2002 Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Gyrene:You must mean the Remington M1897 "Trench Gun" Here's a link for a original one on sale Shotgun with a bayonet...Nothing says close combat quite like that... GyreneExcept maybe cracked fingernails on top of it...</font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts