maxm2 Posted March 25, 2002 Share Posted March 25, 2002 In one game where I'm trying to cross a ridge with the enemy entrenched on the other side,(Hi Rich!) I'm going crazy because there is no way I can figure out to have anyone peek over the ridge without getting nailed by the ten bajillion enemy units waiting to instantly spot and destroy any unit that crawls or creeps into LOS. Then, while doing a search trying to find out about the coming "advance to contact" command in CMBB, I saw someone comment that a unit "sneaking" advances until spotted or fired on and then withdraws---can that be right? Might I use sneak to peek over the edge of my Ridge From Hell? --Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted March 25, 2002 Share Posted March 25, 2002 A sneaking unit moves until it is fired on and then stops. They don't withdraw (unless the incoming fire convinces them to). They also won't shoot themselves. Sounds like Rich is employing a nice reverse slope defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxm2 Posted March 25, 2002 Author Share Posted March 25, 2002 "A sneaking unit moves until it is fired on and then stops. They don't withdraw (unless the incoming fire convinces them to)." Thanks for the info. I guess I haven't sneaked my guys enough...they get tired. "They also won't shoot themselves." I thought that was due to the Prozac I put in their rations. "Sounds like Rich is employing a nice reverse slope defense." "Nice" is a very relative term..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtweasle Posted March 25, 2002 Share Posted March 25, 2002 You could try a SNEAK to just about the peak of the ridge line, CRAWL another tiny bit to just at the apex and then a FAST command back to behind the hill. Might work, I've never really tried to do that though... I take it getting around the side and/or into some cover is impractical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted March 25, 2002 Share Posted March 25, 2002 Originally posted by maxm2: "They also won't shoot themselves." I thought that was due to the Prozac I put in their rations.LOL. Perhaps I could have phrased that better... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panzerkid Posted March 25, 2002 Share Posted March 25, 2002 Ive used sharpshooters before to accomplish this task. You could also divide the squad into two so that you could recon from two different points. That way you would divide up the incoming fire or if you only use one of the halves you would only lose that half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xerxes Posted March 25, 2002 Share Posted March 25, 2002 Sneaking units WILL fire on their own if a good enough target (as determined by the TacAI) is spotted. I've had it happen when I didn't want it to. Sneak is still a good choise, as soon as the first unit fires at you, your sneaker should halt. Much better than running over the hill screaming and yelling just to get shot completely to pieces. -marc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imported_WARHAMMER Posted March 25, 2002 Share Posted March 25, 2002 dump some arty on them, put your MGs in a hull down position, and then go "over the top!" food for thought da Hmammer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PawBroon Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 Reverse slope?! But I thought Bates said games in CM were Billiard flat? I want a refund! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 Originally posted by xerxes: Sneaking units WILL fire on their own if a good enough target (as determined by the TacAI) is spotted. I've had it happen when I didn't want it to. I've had squads from opposing sides sneak through each other - as in, the graphics of the soldiers were walking past each other, and the bases were completely overlapped. I was, to say the least, surprised. To check this out I then set up a test where entire platoons snuck past each other in woods. Not believing what was happening, I checked it out some more, and found that you can have squads and platoons sneak past (and through) each other in flat, clear terrain, in the middle of a bright sunny day, and no one will fire a shot. I don't use sneak much anymore. [ March 25, 2002, 09:32 PM: Message edited by: JonS ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerrorX Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 Drop some smoke all over that hill run over it and hide, maybe he wont see you then you can spy on him for awhile in a new location. (stress Maybe) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairbairn-Sykes Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 Originally posted by JonS: ...I checked it out some more, and found that you can have squads and platoons sneak past (and through) each other in flat, clear terrain, in the middle of a bright sunny day, and no one will fire a shot...WOW. That's a rather disheartening outcome... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwacker Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 I'm amazed! I've played CM for a good chunk of the time since it came out and use sneak as my preferred advance mode particularly when I think the enemy is at hand. I never realised that 2 platoons will sneak straight past each other - even if they target one another. That's crazy! I could understand it if they did not spot one another (not the case - I just tested it) but when they do see one another surely they'd shoot - what are they pacifists or something? Yours confused. P.S. Does anyone know what I should do e.g. use crawl, move etc etc ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 It's been known approximately since CM was released that the sneak command is imperfectly realized. Steve posted some months back that among some other changes to movement commands there will be a new Advance to Contact in CM:BB. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwacker Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 OK I did a few quick tests. Crawl, Move and Fast all seem to do what you would expect - the AI keeps advancing as instructed unless there is some incoming heavy fire or the chance to shoot at something juicy. The exception seems to be sneak whereby the AI will only shoot back if it comes under fire - hence the anomaly that 2 sneaking squads may pass right by one another. I guess sneak really does mean sneak - i.e. don't fire unless you really have to! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAEZ Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 Maxm, why waste your time Just send a good artillery barrage behind the ridge and coordinate your advanced with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxm2 Posted March 26, 2002 Author Share Posted March 26, 2002 Thanks for all the information and advice. I too have seen units "sneak" past each other without firing while I tore my hair out while cursing about the great opportunity my "sneakers" were missing. As to some of the suggestions (all of which I thank you for): Why not just plaster the other side of the ridge with arty? No line of sight and all the arty I had insisted on it, the morons. Why not hit "near" the enemy units who are maybe 20 meters away from top of the ridge? Tried it--but we're in the snow and it takes forever to move anywhere, and I had to keep my troops who were going to charge following the barrage close by, and the barrage killed or demoralized several of my guys waiting in poor cover. The enemy, meanwhile, were all entrenched and seemed relatively untouched by what did hit them. Why not sneak a spotter up? No cover at all at the top of the ridge--it's a nice, wide, road from map side to map side. Anyone who poked a nose up got hit by every enemy unit within a hundred meters. Why not cover the ridge top with smoke and then go over? That's probably the best option (had I known that none of the others would work and saved my arty for smoke use); drawback is that as soon as one emerges from the smoke you're in the same fix: lots of entrenched enemy with good fields of fire--they don't take much time to swing their zooks and mgs around. I'm down to 11% morale(!), so this one ought to be over soon. Then my gaming pard is going to switch places and take a shot at it. If he once again waxes me, I'll ask him to write a brief essay about conquering the reverse slope defense, heh-heh! --Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echo Posted March 26, 2002 Share Posted March 26, 2002 Hey Max! Best thing to do is to send all your stragglers to the rear for KP duty. There will be lots of dishes to do when my boys are partying in Berlin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted March 27, 2002 Share Posted March 27, 2002 Originally posted by maxm2: Why not cover the ridge top with smoke and then go over? That's probably the best option (had I known that none of the others would work and saved my arty for smoke use); drawback is that as soon as one emerges from the smoke you're in the same fix: lots of entrenched enemy with good fields of fire--they don't take much time to swing their zooks and mgs around.When attacking, put the smoke on the enemy positions. Then send all your guys to attack each important enemy position one by one at close range. The smoke will prevent enemy units from firing from other positions and you will eat him alive. ...Or rather, I guess your current opponent will when it's his turn to use this tactic against you. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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