Another artillery thing

[Scipio]

Situation :

I give an artillery order to a point with LOS. The order is executed after the normal delay.

I give a correction order over ~50m with LOS. The delay is (example) ~20 seconds.

I give a correction order over ~50m without LOS. The delay is ~3 minutes. The fire comes down somewhere else, but not on the sheduled target area.

a) Why the longer delay? A correction is a correction, or not?

Why does the fire come down to the wrong place?

The reality (taken from my own experience in miltary service, 120mm mortar platoon):

The FO give his correction orders (simplified) like this: plus 100m distance, 50 to the left. An example, the FO want to have the barrage into a wood - usually he can only see it's edge. So he can zero in the fire to the edge and then order +50 distance (for example) without the need to zero in again.

The battery gets the order from the command post which calculates (simplified) into something like + .5 degrees up, + .2 degrees left.

Now back to the game : I think it would make sense if correction order would work like this:

I give an artillery order to a point with LOS. The order is executed after the normal delay.

I give a correction order over ~50m with LOS. The delay is ~20 seconds.

I give a correction order over ~50m without LOS. The delay is ~20 seconds. The fire comes down to the sheduled place.

I give a second correction order over ~50m without LOS. The delay is ~20 seconds, but it is possible that the fire comes down to the wrong place.

[mike the wino2]

Um, no. It would seem logical that you could "walk" arty out of LOS but that is not the case. Irritating? Yes. Realistic? Maybe.

Fire mission begins but off-target. As FO you call back to adjust. Sergei (or Fritz) gets confused and over corrects. Are the rounds falling behind that ridge where you directed them or 60 meters beyond? I don't really like this "feature" but it seems to balance the game IMO.

[Cpt.Kloss]

You would be jumping through a whole map without delay. YOU see enemy, your spotter does not. But according to your logic your spotter says: correct 1000m because my uber commander (player) told me there is an infantry unit in that forest!And I want no delay.

Althoug your logic is correct, CMBB is a radar game (you as commander see all - and you -not your spotter - give coordinates and issue fire order).

regards

[Pak40]

I mostly agree with Scipio. There should be a way to add fifty meters to a fire mission without a major time penalty. If the FO says "plus fifty meters", then the battery adjusts the guns however many degrees. The amount of degree is already known for set distances such as 50 or 100 meters. It should make no difference if the intended target is out of LOS of the FO: fifty meters is fifty meters.

Also, the allowable area for adjusting is way too small. Obviously guns of all calibers could make quick adjustments for several hundred meters in any direction without having to totally recalibrate(rotate the entire gun). I'm assuming that artillery guns are traversable like anti-tank guns.

Rolling barrages gradually increase in distance for way more than 50 meters, so we know that increasing or decreasing gun elevation can be done without major recalibration.

[Hat Trick]

Perhaps a solution is to allow the adjustment to an area out of the LOS with a short time delay (reflecting the ease of making adjustments to existing fire), but with some loss of accuracy (reflecting the fact that the FO is not able to actually see the new target area, and so in real life would not be able to call in fire exactly where the player wanted).

[Terrapin]

I think it should remain as is. Mike Wino is right, without the delay the game becomes one big contest on who can rain the most amount of steel onto gigantic sections of map, with nearly no penalty at all (and, no, less accuracy isn't a huge deal with 120MM arty on a map that is 1200M wide). It would be dull and boring.

[Bruno Weiss]

I betcha the Finnish artillery don't do that.

[Guest Sgt. Emren]

The amount of degree is already known for set distances such as 50 or 100 meters. It should make no difference if the intended target is out of LOS of the FO: fifty meters is fifty meters.

What about the slope of terrain? If you're firing "downhill", any given change in degrees will give a larger shift on the z-axis than when firing "uphill".

[JonS]

Originally posted by Sgt. Emren:

What about the slope of terrain? If you're firing "downhill", any given change in degrees will give a larger shift on the z-axis than when firing "uphill".

Ah slope. God it can be frustrating! How does the old maxim go? "Half up, double down"? Or somefink.

[Warhammer]

I agree about the timing issue. In some instances it can be 20 min. w/o LOS. I've also experienced the misfiring of arty. In the game I'm playing against the AI, my arty is far left, both with 105mm and 81mm. Glitch?

[Scipio]

Originally posted by Cpt.Kloss:

You would be jumping through a whole map without delay. YOU see enemy, your spotter does not. But according to your logic your spotter says: correct 1000m because my uber commander (player) told me there is an infantry unit in that forest!And I want no delay.

Althoug your logic is correct, CMBB is a radar game (you as commander see all - and you -not your spotter - give coordinates and issue fire order).

regards

You are wrong, because a fire correction given on a target that's already out of LOS is very likly to go to the wrong place.

Anyway, I can understand your critics, except the delay. I order a correction 50m with LOS, delay ~20 seconds. When I add a single meter, so the the FO lost the LOS, I have a 3 min delay. That's really stupid.