favorite allied artillary?

[streamkeeper]

I know this is kind of a trite question, but I love the game and haven't had the time to invest in understanding the variation amoung the artillary units. This is mostly because in most of my missions I manage 3 spotters at best.

So what is your most favorite and why?

I have been using the 81mm mortarst mostly, because of thier large ammo count and low price. I am doing this to get down how and when spotter should work.

Thanks in advance.

Also, could someone explain what the suffix "VT" stands for?

[ChrisPick]

Streamkeeper,

VT is "variable timed" and refers to the fuses in the shells which allowed the easy production of "airbursts" (shells exploding a short distance above the ground, to cause maximum fragmentation effect). They drastically increase the effect of the shells versus infantry in open ground, similar to the artificial airbursts created in woods, by the shells impacting trees above the ground.

My favourite FO's are the naval guns (heh heh) or the 300+mm rockets (roll the dice and see which side gets to go home in one piece...

Cheers,

Chris

[Oberst Angsthase]

I like 'em in pairs. The 81s will pin the enemy but won't hurt them bad enough (Although I once lost an entire German platoon in VOT to 81s, I haven't been able to duplicate those results) I will usually pin the enemy with smaller caliber artillery fire and kill em with short burts of something bigger--150 to 230. It's amazing to watch that heavy stuff come down!

[Dirtweasle]

Those VT units are deadly to troops, vehicles and tanks in the open. If given the chance I'll take them and also an off board 81mm mortar unit for smoke, troop fixing, H&I.

Have'nt had luck with the German rockets, but 2 out of 3 hamsters disagree.

[Guest Michael emrys]

I nearly always get a battery of 81mm. They are pretty good bang for the buck. 105s really rock and aren't too costly. I haven't used 155s yet, so I can't speak of them. Tried 8"; they made big explosions, but I'm not convinced they were really all that useful. Haven't tried the bigger stuff.

That's all American stuff as I haven't played any other side yet.

Michael

[109 Gustav]

105s are great for busting concrete bunkers, especially ones like antitank bunkers that you don't want to approach unless you have to, or bunkers that can't be flanked. It takes something like an average of 10 ammo to take one out, though.

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There is nothing certain about war except that one side won't win.

-Ian Hamilton

[Check6]

Interestingly, I dumped two whole batteries of observed 105 fire on the AT bunker in VoT with no effect. That's around 150 rounds.

[Olle Petersson]

My #1 favourite is the 4.2" mortar.

It's got fast response time, fair amount of ammo, a fair punch and a reasonable price.

For a trio of spotters, I'd take one 4.2" mortar, one 81mm mortar (good for smoke and infantry suppression) and one 105mm howitzer, VT if available.

Cheers

Olle

[Guest Michael emrys]

I got around to trying the 155 the other day. The explosions were quite impressive, but there weren't many of them, and since it was an area target, they were pretty spread out.

What I am starting to gravitate towards is using the 105s for saturation of a target area for preliminary softening up and switching to 81s when my troops start to get close, finally using on-map 60s if I encounter a strong point that's giving my infantry trouble.

Michael

[Jarmo]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 109 Gustav:

105s are great for busting concrete bunkers<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not after 1.03 they aren't.

Still are good against infantry.

Never leave home without 81mm observer. It's the thing for pinning

infantry and killing guns. 4,2" is another piece of brilliance.

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Now, would this brilliant plan involve us climbing out of

our trenches and walking slowly towards the enemy sir?

[IntelWeenie]

US 81mm Mortars rain supreme! No, that's not a typo ; with 200 rounds and fast response times (2 min or less), these batteries are fearsome to infantry. The only drawback to them is a limited utility in built-up areas and against bunkers due to their smaller caliber. They also excel at quickly laying massive smoke screens, bogging down your CPU like nothing else!

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Canada: Where men were men, unless they were horses.

-Dudley Do-right

[Steve P]

Try the 14" naval guns. they kill everything!

[Olle Petersson]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Steve P:

Try the 14" naval guns. they kill everything!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Everything but pillboxes, that is.

And they're slow to reload...

Cheers

Olle

[Nick Carter]

When screwing around with quick battles, I like to take 3 or 4 81mm mortar FO's, keep them together and target the same spot simultaneously. The rain of shells will kill everything except armour in that area. I then walk the mortars around destroying concentrations at leisure until the ammo runs out.

[Guest Michael emrys]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Nick Carter:

When screwing around with quick battles, I like to take 3 or 4 81mm mortar FO's, keep them together and target the same spot simultaneously. The rain of shells will kill everything except armour in that area. I then walk the mortars around destroying concentrations at leisure until the ammo runs out.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, you've got the spirit if not the letter of history correct. The Germans used to complain that the British and US infantry didn't fight for ground, they occupied it after their artillery obliterated all the defending troops.

Michael

[chrisl]

Don't leave home without your 81's-- they're great for a smoke screen, and suppression too.

105 are a nice bang for the buck, especially with lots of trees for your enemy to die in.

On-map 60 mm indirect fire is great when you've got to get it there fast.

[Maastrictian]

While I agree with the general afection for 81mm / 3" mortors I do have some comments. City fighting (heavy buildings) make 81s far too small, even 105s can be too small. 150 or greater is really whats needed. If I can aford it, in a city fight I like 155 and soemthing big, 8" range (not 14", that's silly ). Sure the big guys fire slow, but that just means you have more rounds of fire total. Also, when playing Brits dont' forget the 25lbs. Think of it as a cheeper 105 that is more accurate (as far as I can tell). Defaintely more accurate than a 3" or 4.2" mortor. On the other hand, because of the massive delay, Brit arty can be really frustrating.

--Chris

[Olle Petersson]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Nick Carter:

When screwing around with quick battles, I like to take 3 or 4 81mm mortar FO's, ... I then walk the mortars around destroying concentrations at leisure until the ammo runs out.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What I find a bit disturbing with these mortars (and most other artillery) in CM is that the rate of fire is way too high.

In reality, these mortars can maintain the high ROF used in CM for one or two minutes. Then the heat buildup in the barrels is such that the maximum ROF drops to one or two rounds per minute, maintaining temperature of the barrel. Taking a 10 min pause in firing would allow for another one minute burst...

For heavier guns, including tank guns, a sustained firing mission would exhaust the loader and ammo haulers. This isn't included in CM either.

On the CM gunnery range I did, several different tanks, SP and towed guns fired continously for more than 10 turns without the crew being noted as "Tired" or ROF dropping.

Very unrealistic...

Cheers

Olle

[Maj. Bosco]

For all practicle purposes I've got to go with the 105's. For purposes of causing faint hearted oponents to drop dead from fright I've got to go with the naval guns. I don't care what anyone says. Anything that blows up churches and stone buildings without even landing on them is sick.

[Maj. Bosco]

I've really got to start paying more attention to the latest post before posting...

Olle, I think that the thing you're talking about was kind of adressed already in a series of posts about CM firefights taking place on an unrealistic time scale. The same magic that allows an engagement that in real life WWII would take the better part of a day can occur in CM in 15 or 16 turns (read minutes) allows artillery fire it's amazing endurace.

[Thorondor]

I did national service in the Norwegian Field artillery last year, and thus have some first hand knowledge of the loading and fiering of artillery, namely M109A3GN 155mm self proppelled howitzers. This version is not the autoloading Paladin fielded by the US, but has a manualy loaded Reihnmetal weapon. Granted, it is not actual WWII piece, but judgin from the older display pieces (Among them 105s) we had standing around the mecanism is basicaly the same. And some of sigth adjustment instruments had the eagle of the Reich on them.

On the the issue of artillerty endurance, this is dependent on many factors, like previous activity that day and ammo supply. The battery record for a three shot barrage was about 13 seconds. The procedure was of course not exactly acording to drill, but thats probably the way it would be in a war. A trained 155mm crew can, upholding drill and all, fire a three shot barrage on a 20-25 second average without to much extra effort. This is using separate bag charges, and having to ram the grenade into the chamber. A 105, fiering regualr shells, could fire a barrage much faster. We did series of several barrages in fast sucsession without great dificulty, and again a 105 crew would have a even easier job.

It is my impression that what takes time in bringing down arty fire is not as much the reload time of the weapon, with the exception of the REALY big guns, but calculating the fiering data. We did this by computer. We did however fire with manualy calulated data at one ocation during the final testing of the battery. During this shoting the guns where on stand by while the data was calculated, wich took some minutes. It would therefore be asumed that the time between shots is CM is actualy used for calculating and reaiming rather than just reloading. Maybe the rate of fire should increase when the guns are zeroed on a target?

There is altso a strong posiblity that the reload time is a game balancer. A six gun 155mm battery each fiering three shots in 25 sec would maybe be a bit to much firepower for a blanced game. But a full Nebelwerfer barrage would be a awsome sigth

[This message has been edited by Thorondor (edited 09-14-2000).]

[Olle Petersson]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Thorondor:

The battery record for a three shot barrage was about 13 seconds.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is about what's depicted in CM.

So you were able to shoot about 20 rounds at the same target within three minutes? (Which is what is done in CM...)

Cheers

Olle

[This message has been edited by Olle Petersson (edited 09-15-2000).]

[Thorondor]

It would be har for one piece(Short of a PanzerHaubitz 2000) to manage that. A battery is however made up of 6 or more pieces, and would be capapable of delivering a shell every four seconds with little dificulty. The normal way (for us, at least) to execute a fire mission would be to first fire spoting rounds to get on target, and then fire a three shot barrage form all the guns, 18 shells in from 20 to 30 seconds on a normal day, and then repeat as needed.

My post was actualy inended to give some information on the way artillery opperate today, and the rough reloading times of a FA piece. Maybe it should have been under anouther thread, but here it is anyway.

As a curiousity: Largest amount of atillery fire per meter of frontline: The russians did at one point of the drive for berlin comit 10000 pieces to 10 kilometers of front. The tactic used was to fire a continous line of shells, move it 50 meters, and fire again. Not a very nice thing to have happen to you.