this is what i want....

[Deadly Dave]

my wish list

undo command to retrieve those reposition arty commands that will now cost you an extra 21 seconds

a clock on the opponant finder page so you know how long ago it was posted

a complete choice of troop experiences conscript through to elite all within the same battle

better control over aircraft lets say a TRP that arrives like reinforecments do so you can place say two turns before the aircraft arrives you could restrict pacement of it to LOS from HQ

closer pooling of troops at set up instead of in a line

more set up zone options eg squares or half width zones not necassarily directly opposite enemy

just some thoughts

[Farnz]

A few responses

I like the fact you don't know the penatly you're going to have to pay for repositioning your arty strike. If it bugs you that much ...alt S.

Isn't there a post time ?

I agree here. Given that tank/arty etc are often attached to various infanrty groups there is now reason for them to be the same 'experience'. It you chose medium you get regular/vet so why not a mix.

I can see what you mean but TRPs for aircraft might only be realistic for scenarios and only then for buildings/defensive positions. Aircraft are never scheduled to arrive on a particular turn so using TRP would be tricky.

Setup areas of equal area but not necessarily symetrical would be an interesting idea...add to the fog of war and all that....

Cheers Farnz

[Le Tondu]

Originally posted by Deadly Dave:

my wish list

.............a complete choice of troop experiences conscript through to elite all within the same battle.............

I'm sure that you mean Quick Battle. Excellent idea. That would get my vote.

[Deadly Dave]

Originally posted by Farnz:

A few responses

Isn't there a post time ?

Cheers Farnz

yes but if you dont live in EST how do yu know how long it was since it was posted unless yu had the same time as the CM forum page. . have a look at the times peole send their posts and you can assume that generaly people arent looking for games at 3 in the morning. most likely they live in another time zone so if I check who wants a game and an entry says "l'll wait half an hour" and its posted at 3am EST how do I kow how long its been there unless I have an EST clocktime on the forum page header

so invariably i write a note back and say "are you still there?" and then I have to wait to se if they reply. The time of posting needs t be compared to CM forum time to see how old the post is

[Deadly Dave]

Originally posted by Farnz:

A few responses

I can see what you mean but TRPs for aircraft might only be realistic for scenarios and only then for buildings/defensive positions. Aircraft are never scheduled to arrive on a particular turn so using TRP would be tricky.

Cheers Farnz

If Im a n HQ and Ive ordered an airstrike( which I did at troop selection) then surely Im going to give some coordinates to the aircraft. having a trp able to be placed within LOS of HQ would in effect do this. To keep some measure of uncertainty you could get a notification that says something like "AIrcaraft due in approx 3 mintutes" (3 turns) I could then place my trp in the area I want bombed (similar to Arty) then leave it up to the Ai to do the rest

[Compassion]

Originally posted by Farnz:

I like the fact you don't know the penatly you're going to have to pay for repositioning your arty strike.

I don't think that's quite what he's talking about. If you are lining up a reposition and decide to opt out (Can't get a good angle, whatever), you are stuck if you had actually hit T. YOu end up being forced to do a reposision even though you had thought better of it a second later.

I'm All for real live analogs, but it's silly to think that all the tubes would have gone cockeyed because you keyed your radio, ya know?

[ April 11, 2002, 06:53 PM: Message edited by: Compassion ]

[Pvt. Ryan]

Originally posted by Deadly Dave:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Farnz:

A few responses

I can see what you mean but TRPs for aircraft might only be realistic for scenarios and only then for buildings/defensive positions. Aircraft are never scheduled to arrive on a particular turn so using TRP would be tricky.

Cheers Farnz

If Im a n HQ and Ive ordered an airstrike( which I did at troop selection) then surely Im going to give some coordinates to the aircraft. having a trp able to be placed within LOS of HQ would in effect do this. To keep some measure of uncertainty you could get a notification that says something like "AIrcaraft due in approx 3 mintutes" (3 turns) I could then place my trp in the area I want bombed (similar to Arty) then leave it up to the Ai to do the rest</font>

[aka_tom_w]

Originally posted by Deadly Dave:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Farnz:

A few responses

I can see what you mean but TRPs for aircraft might only be realistic for scenarios and only then for buildings/defensive positions. Aircraft are never scheduled to arrive on a particular turn so using TRP would be tricky.

Cheers Farnz

If Im a n HQ and Ive ordered an airstrike( which I did at troop selection) then surely Im going to give some coordinates to the aircraft. having a trp able to be placed within LOS of HQ would in effect do this. To keep some measure of uncertainty you could get a notification that says something like "AIrcaraft due in approx 3 mintutes" (3 turns) I could then place my trp in the area I want bombed (similar to Arty) then leave it up to the Ai to do the rest</font>

[aka_tom_w]

"if Im a n HQ and Ive ordered an airstrike( which I did at troop selection) then surely Im going to give

some coordinates to the aircraft. having a trp able to be placed within LOS of HQ would in effect do

this. To keep some measure of uncertainty you could get a notification that says something like

"AIrcaraft due in approx 3 mintutes" (3 turns) I could then place my trp in the area I want bombed

(similar to Arty) then leave it up to the Ai to do the rest"

Dave,

no

you are not an HQ ordering an airstrike

you are a bunch of guys on the ground and you are lucky that the air force showed up on time and on target today, and sometimes you are unlucky and they target you.

there was virtually no communication between the airforce and the army.

the airstrike option is in the available list of things to buy so that scenario designers can build historically accruate scenarios.

Any player that "buys" an CAS air strike in a QB or an ME risks two BAD things happening, first the airstrike might not show up (major waste of points), ok secondly the aircraft shows up, and more BAD news this time, they attack your friendly units because they don't know any better.

(ok third option, they identify enemy units and actually engage them IF, there is NO AAA flak present)

Bottom Line:

ANYONE who plays to WIN, (I mean competively) never buys an Air Strike in QB ME

-tom w

[ April 11, 2002, 07:25 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

[JonS]

Originally posted by aka_tom_w:

...there was no communication between the dough's (ground pounders) and airforce on the allied side...

While I agree with your general point about poor comms between ground and air elements and numerous short-bombing incidents, to say that there was no comms is just flat out wrong. The DAF had developed quite effective ground-air proceedures by the time of Op Crusader in Nov '41*. These proceedures were gradually improved through the rest of the war in Africa. Unfortunately, they weren't transferred terribly effectively back to England, and by the time of Op Overlord the procedures there were still someway behind those in the Med.

However, they learnt quickly, and by late July/Aug the proceedures for CAS were pretty well in place, including FACs running around in AFVs with radios capable of talking to pilots in the air and ground units in contact. Typically, FACs were allocated on a scale of about one per Bde. FACs were themselves pilots, and as such were able to talk to the a/c overhead in language the pilots could understand. Unfortunately, the FACs were relativly rare and if their vehicle was shot up by the enemy, or had a mechanical failure, then that was usually it for CAS for that day.

Regards

JonS

* eg, the time from call for support to planes overhead could be as low as 30mins during Op Crusader.

Edit: spelling

[ April 11, 2002, 07:37 PM: Message edited by: JonS ]

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by Deadly Dave:

...if you dont live in EST how do yu know how long it was since it was posted unless yu had the same time as the CM forum page...

Easy. You do know what time zone you're in, right? So you just make an appropriate adjustment and Bob's your uncle. For instance, I live in the Pacific time zone, so the East Coast is three hours ahead of me. If I want to know what time my time someone posted, I subtract three hours off the time mark on the post. Er, you also have to take into account that the clock on the Battlefront server is fast, 26 minutes I think the last time I checked.

Michael

[Deadly Dave]

Originally posted by Michael emrys:

.[/qb]

Easy. You do know what time zone you're in, right? So you just make an appropriate adjustment and Bob's your uncle. For instance, I live in the Pacific time zone, so the East Coast is three hours ahead of me. If I want to know what time my time someone posted, I subtract three hours off the time mark on the post. Er, you also have to take into account that the clock on the Battlefront server is fast, 26 minutes I think the last time I checked.

Michael[/QB]

[Deadly Dave]

Originally posted by Compassion:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Farnz:

I like the fact you don't know the penatly you're going to have to pay for repositioning your arty strike.

I don't think that's quite what he's talking about. If you are lining up a reposition and decide to opt out (Can't get a good angle, whatever), you are stuck if you had actually hit T. YOu end up being forced to do a reposision even though you had thought better of it a second later.

I'm All for real live analogs, but it's silly to think that all the tubes would have gone cockeyed because you keyed your radio, ya know?</font>

[109 Gustav]

Originally posted by Deadly Dave:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Compassion:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Farnz:

I like the fact you don't know the penatly you're going to have to pay for repositioning your arty strike.

I don't think that's quite what he's talking about. If you are lining up a reposition and decide to opt out (Can't get a good angle, whatever), you are stuck if you had actually hit T. YOu end up being forced to do a reposision even though you had thought better of it a second later.

I'm All for real live analogs, but it's silly to think that all the tubes would have gone cockeyed because you keyed your radio, ya know?</font>

[BeauCoupDinkyDau]

JonS is correct. I remember reading in Cornelius Ryan's A Bridge Too Far that XXX Corps had RAF officers that road in vechicles with the colum and called out targets by radio to the RAF.

BTW Jon, where are those new and awsome Axis guns you were working on? :confused:

[ April 12, 2002, 01:21 AM: Message edited by: Vader's Jester ]

[Compassion]

Originally posted by Vader's Jester:

JonS is correct. I remember reading in Cornelius Ryan's A Bridge Too Far that XXX Corps had RAF officers that road in vechicles with the colum and called out targets by radio to the RAF.

The use of FAC's was still in it's infancy at the time. The were learning how to deliver CAS of the super close variety that we see in CM day by day. IT's noted in ABTF that the FAC's were lost so the Typhoons in the attempt to push out of Nijmegan didn't fire on a gun that basically doomed the link-up attempt becasue they had strict orders not to fire wihtout FAC control because of all the FF casualties in previous days in the battle wihtout FAC's.

Doubler's Closing With The Enemy goes into detail about the growth (and need) of Forward Air Controllers.

[JonS]

Compassion,

I did point out some of the problems with the CAS system at that time in my post. My point is that it was a little more developed than people generally seem to realise.

Vader

Sorry, I think you're barking up the wrong Jon. I have all the artistic ability of ... a rock

Regards

JonS

[Madmatt]

The clock on this server WAS 34 minutes slow, it is correctly set to EST (-5GMT) now.

In CMBB there is now a Reset Target key for FO's that you can press after you have targeted a new position that will do as it claims, reset the target point to what it was when the turn was originally loaded with no penalty tacked on.

Madmatt

[aka_tom_w]

Originally posted by Madmatt:

The clock on this server WAS 34 minutes slow, it is correctly set to EST (-5GMT) now.

In CMBB there is now a Reset Target key for FO's that you can press after you have targeted a new position that will do as it claims, reset the target point to what it was when the turn was originally loaded with no penalty tacked on.

Madmatt

"In CMBB there is now a Reset Target key for FO's that you can press after you have targeted a new position that will do as it claims, reset the target point to what it was when the turn was originally loaded with no penalty tacked on."

That smells like a BONE to me

Great Feature,

thanks, it will be much appreciated!

-tom w

[ April 12, 2002, 01:12 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by Madmatt:

The clock on this server WAS 34 minutes slow, it is correctly set to EST (-5GMT) now.

In CMBB there is now a Reset Target key for FO's that you can press after you have targeted a new position that will do as it claims, reset the target point to what it was when the turn was originally loaded with no penalty tacked on.

Bravo! to both announcements.

Michael