atiff Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Hi all, Seeing some of the CMAK screenies on Boots & Tracks got me wondering; how many German halftracks were used in Egypt and Libya? (ie, under Rommel's DAK) Does anyone know of specific numbers in the Panzer divisions, for example? I have not read a lot of books on North Africa, mostly the New Zealand histories, and can't remember mention of any halftracks. Obviously a lot of movement was done with trucks. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rune Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 if you are talking about the SPW 251/1, then the max of one of the divisions was a whopping 7, and for 21st Panzer I believe it was a whopping 12. Halftracks were rare in Africa. Rune 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ant Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Originally posted by rune: if you are talking about the SPW 251/1, then the max of one of the divisions was a whopping 7, and for 21st Panzer I believe it was a whopping 12. Halftracks were rare in Africa. Rune Pah, rubbish! I've seen all those North Africa war films.....there were halftracks everywhere. Every German soldier had his own Seriously though those are interesting figures. I wonder if CMAK will refect those with rarity values? [ October 15, 2003, 05:27 AM: Message edited by: Ant ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Originally posted by Ant: Pah, rubbish! I've seen all those North Africa war films.....there were halftracks everywhere. Every German soldier had his own [/QB]But those all looked suspiciously like M3s 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ant Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Originally posted by flamingknives: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Ant: Pah, rubbish! I've seen all those North Africa war films.....there were halftracks everywhere. Every German soldier had his own But those all looked suspiciously like M3s [/QB]</font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Originally posted by flamingknives: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Ant: Pah, rubbish! I've seen all those North Africa war films.....there were halftracks everywhere. Every German soldier had his own But those all looked suspiciously like M3s [/QB]</font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeinzBaby Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 I thought the 104th and 115th Regt's from the 15th Pz had SPW's... Len Deighton's book "Blitzkrieg" has a great doublepage spread of TOE for 1 Pz div of May 1940, though this is before Hitler doubled his Pz divs by dividing them to 1 Pz Regt and 2 Inf Reg's apiece, one Inf Regt would have SPW's the other trucks. The new Organisation was stronger than the hybrid 'Leichte' Divs, which the 5th Pz was, though this in turn was beefed up and renamed 21st Pz. I read somewhere that the 15th Pz was originally made from the cadre/nucleus of an Infantry Div and fought for the first time as Armour in Libya gaining it awesome reputation... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rune Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Heinz, I have a day by day count of tanks and armoured vehicles for the region. The guys got a kick out of some of the units, like the 33rd Motorized Butcher Platoon, of the 33rd Motorized Bakers Company, and etc. Sorry, the SPW 251/1 was rare in NA. Rune 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Rarer in Africa than generally - but in addition, SPWs weren't all that common in the first period of the war. The explosion in their numbers really comes in 1943-44. The early war light armor force was split between lighter tanks than those used late, and wheeled ACs. Through the end of 1941, less than 1400 SPWs of the standard types were fielded. They were outnumbered by Panzer Is (though those phased out early) and again by Panzer IIs. There were half again as many armored cars, in several series each of around 400 vehicles. (221, 222, 223, 232, lesser types as well). Also around 400 command or arty halftracks (253 and 254), some light SPAT and a few SPA conversions. Depending on what you count, only about 1/5 to 1/4 of the early war light armor force were half tracks. The bulk of the infantry of the panzer divisions (not even called "panzergrenadiers" yet) was motorized, in trucks. The recon guys were on motorcycles or in trucks, and supported by armored cars rather than gun halftracks. Panzer regiments scouted for themselves with Pz IIs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Let us also not forget that even once HTs became fairly common the Germans almost never had a fully armored Panzer Division. With the exception of Lehr Panzer (and that only for a brief period) the vast majority of the infantry was in trucks and often even on bicycles or LPCs (Leather Personnel Carriers). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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