Fanatics or sat on a horseshoe?

[Wingmanx]

I know that the game occasionally has fanatics appear in it, and you don't know who or when they show up, and I'm not sure how to spot them other than noticing a squad that won't route or panic in the face of heavy fire (save flamethrowers of course). But I wasn't sure if this was a case of a random fanatic squad or just guys that really live a charmed existence.

***

Basically, to get myself more familiar with anti-armor tactics -without- the use of ATGs, armor of my own, or otherwise, the setting was a large town, with german armor (supported by some infantry) moving in. My forces consisted of Canadian Engineers. At any rate, tactics consisted of hide, wait for the tanks to come close and ambush them.

So, a Marder rolls up near one of the buildings I have a squad hiding in. So naturally, I order them to assault the gun, which they prepare to do. Only problem is, right before they go to attack, during the command delay, the Marder spots them. And though it's at point-blank range, immediately goes into reverse. The Engineers, being obedient little fellahs, dash out into the street to follow it, and my heart sank as I saw the Marder lowering it's gun in their direction as it reversed. The first blast, at a range about 20 meters or so hit just behind them. They got shaken, but amazingly took no casualties, so they kept chasing the gun. It fired a second and third time, both blasts inflicting one casualty, and both making the squad 'shaken' but the effect wore off quickly, and of course the crazy SOBs keep chasing the gun. At this point it ran out of room, backing into a building and coming to a halt, allowing the engineers to catch up and dispatch it with their demolition charges. All without once hitting the dirt during their run face on into danger.

Fanatics or no, I wish I could give these guys medals either way. ;P

[Bone_Vulture]

I do not wish to sound snide, but it's a waste to use engineers against such a frail target as a Marder. That tin can can barely withstand a hand grenade, and most of the models don't even have an MG to ward off pesky meat puppets.

If your troops enjoy a superior cover contrast (your troops in a building, the tank on an open street), you might want to just set them a cover arc so that they will attempt to target the tank just when it is passing by.

If you set the tank as a target manually, be sure to give your troops a run/advance order away from the tank, deeper in to the building. With a proper delay set with a pause command, your troops will attempt to chuck explosives at the tank once or twice, and fail or not, they'll withdraw to safety in the end. Giving a follow order will likely lead to catastrophy, especially if the tank is nimble and wary of contact.

[Wingmanx]

Something that I'll keep in mind is the part about retreating back further into the building, though yes I know that running out into the street to assault a tank at that range is putting the guys at unnecessary risk, it was a deliberate choice on my part. I did say this was to familiarize myself with the tactics against armor with just infantry, perhaps I should have worded it as I wanted to see the 'effects'. At the time I wasn't too concerned about losing an engineer squad in the interests of seeing the boom of a demolition charge on a vehicle, as I was still new to this part of the game. I wanted to see an explosion. I just didn't expect the chase that would result.

But getting back to my initial curiosity, is whether or not the fact they took the blasts at point blank range and only got very temporarily 'shaken', even while taking two casualties in a short period of time, is it a sign of fanatics or were they just really lucky? The squad were Regulars as I recall.

[ July 21, 2005, 05:46 AM: Message edited by: Wingmanx ]

[Soddball]

It certainly sounds like they were fanatics. Were they in command radius and if so, with which commander and which bonuses?

Always good to hear a fun story like that, Wingmanx.

[imported_no_one]

As a general rule,only ambush armor from cover,while making sure to stay in the cover.I never,ever,ever,unless through sheer desperation,send my troops out in the open to die.If that had been a t-34 with canister,fanatics or not = dead!

Remember that when infantry are trying to KO armor,it is an abstraction.What you don't see is that there are some dudes running out there with the explosives to try and KO the tank;therefore,there is no need for you to do it manually.

[Kingfish]

You know, I wouldn't dismiss the horseshoe theory all together.

[ July 21, 2005, 10:25 AM: Message edited by: Kingfish ]

[Bone_Vulture]

I'd like to add that minor HE shell blasts (meaning less than medium off-screen artillery does) rarely shake infantry squads for long, especially if the blast results in no casualties.

[juan_gigante]

But usually when I see a squad take two casualties in close succession, it goes worse than a brief "shaken". Hell, even just the three blasts of 75mm would probably pin the guys if they were my infantry. Once I actually saw a squad broken after haven taken no casualties from a nearby explosion. That's regulars for you, I guess. Winmanx, I think you experience definately goes past luck. Was it a scenario or QB? Because I think that QBs can't have fanatic troops.

[Wingmanx]

It was a quick battle. I didn't know that fanatics couldn't appear in QBs. If that's the case then these guys were probably just really lucky then.

[Zalgiris 1410]

Good story Wingmanx, I love it when Infantry take out an AFV with demo charges or grenade bundles. Fun to watch and hope! I agree with the other posts that it is best to stay in cover and let the AFV come to you, that is the ideal method given that the situation comes about. However it doesn't always pass close enough and you then have to move closer or follow it from behind and those emergency actions can be more fun. It is too easy to wait for the AFV to expose its self to a hiding squad, though that is best tactically for your troops. Obviously, but it is heartening to move troops against enemy tanks that have broken into your MLR or town, village or whatever and actually remove them when you've got no other means to do so.

The AI is bad at handling armour and I find that it will advance tanks into villages and towns without Infantry support. Easy to close assault.

[juan_gigante]

I love playing all those Stalingrad city scenarios because they are rife with opportunites to close assault tanks. The only thing cooler than close assaulting tanks with engineers is doing it with flamethrowers. Fire!