ww2steel Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Okay, I was doing some work on the SU122. I noticed that in the editor (where it displays rarity but does not alter the points by it) the SU122 is: 111 points Jan-Apr '43 (rare 50 - 100%) 112 points May-Dec '43 (rare 40 - 65%) 117 points Jan '44+ (rare 40 - 125%) Okay, I understand possibly the first one because that's when HEAT ammo becomes available (just one point added?), but not the second one. I see absolutely nothing that changes here, but I checked it on a few other Soviet vehicles (including the captured Panther, which does not change points in German service), and all of them change points values between Dec'43 - Jan'44. Why? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 4, 2006 Author Share Posted July 4, 2006 Hmm, the platoon sizes change. Maybe it's an effort to keep the number of points the same per vehicle per platoon. What I mean: (Su-122 again) 4 vehicle plt = 408 = 102 each (1944+) 2 vehicle plt = 206 = 103 each (1943-) Maybe? Anybody? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitchen frizzy Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Does it have anything to do with command lag? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 4, 2006 Author Share Posted July 4, 2006 hmm. I'll check BRB. Back... Darn skippy. Both regulars, everything else identical. A single movement command takes 10 seconds in dec'43 and 7 seconds in Jan'44. Why is that? Mike [ July 03, 2006, 09:47 PM: Message edited by: ww2steel ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitchen frizzy Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 It's the way the game accounts for improved Soviet leadership and communications as the war progressed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 4, 2006 Author Share Posted July 4, 2006 Okay, that's cool. Another I noticed is the later Panther A changed points slightly in I think April -May of '44. Ideas? Mike 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tar Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 Did the ammo improve? Was there a (small?) change in the penetration numbers? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitchen frizzy Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 Also, does the Panther's points increase or decrease? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 6, 2006 Author Share Posted July 6, 2006 Ammo is perfectly identical for all of the Panther's actual service career as reflected by CMBB. (The actual point change is Feb - Mar '44.) It dropped from 241 to 238. All of the other (German) Panthers keep the same points values throughout the career. The Panther A stats page is identical (I checked at both dates to be sute). Maybe something with the nahverteidigungswaffe? Different HE, removal of smoke grenades? As the Panther G is not running yet I cannot compare the changes between it and the Panther A (e) against anyhting else, like the Nahv or the dual mag optics. Mike 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitchen frizzy Posted July 7, 2006 Share Posted July 7, 2006 See if there's a difference in armor quality. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 7, 2006 Author Share Posted July 7, 2006 Nope, not displayed at least. I checked command lag too, identical. (It did chance it the Sov Captured Panther A (early), which explains its points change.) Mike 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted July 7, 2006 Share Posted July 7, 2006 Perhaps it's to do with the Russians getting some new kit in March '44 that can deal more effectively with Panthers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 7, 2006 Author Share Posted July 7, 2006 So maybe the Soviets get more effective so the Panther is relatively cheaper? Any why only the later Panther A? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 There are ammo improvements that are not displayed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 10, 2006 Author Share Posted July 10, 2006 Something better about the main gun performance in the later A model only? I figured that since it didn't effect the 3 earlier models that it must be something that changed on the A model, such as optics or the nahv. It seems if it is a chance in the main gun performance that it would effect the D model, etc. Thanks, Mike 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted July 11, 2006 Share Posted July 11, 2006 It's not by gun, it is by time. Certain ammo types are assumed to be more effective and at that time all vehicles mounting a gun firing that ammo get more expensive. Another hidden parameter is steel brittleness, IIRC, and the deflection of angled shots based on whether it is face-hardened armor or not. [ July 11, 2006, 07:47 PM: Message edited by: Redwolf ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 12, 2006 Author Share Posted July 12, 2006 But why would it not effect the Panther D, or Panther A (early)? They have the same gun and practically the same armor. It has to be something that is different the late model A from the Ds and the early A. Mike 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 12, 2006 Author Share Posted July 12, 2006 I think it's the Nahv. All Panthers after the late A change points Feb-Mar '44. The later ones too, if you take them back to unrealistic dates. So does the Jagdpanther. I'll do more checking. Mike 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww2steel Posted July 12, 2006 Author Share Posted July 12, 2006 Okay, I checked every peice of German armor that existed at any time during the war. The only ones that change in Feb to Mar '44 are The Panther A (late), both Panther G, and both Jagdpanther. To make this more confusing, they change different ammounts, and go both positive and negative. Feb Mar A(l) 241 238 = -3 G(e) 230 234 = +4 G(l) 245 238 = -7 JP(e) 241 250 = +9 JP(l) 238 250 = +12 I am even more confused now! :confused: :confused: :confused: Mike 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 That is certainly not the ammo changes I meant, those mostly apply to the Soviets. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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