Panzer_M Posted June 1, 2004 Share Posted June 1, 2004 SPOILERS Below. AAR kinda. * * * * * ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * I was playing a operation I made called. The Way To The FatherLand. Which is Aug/44 in North Russian/Baltic in a hilly area. Hill 207 and 186 are the anchor points of my AT line that runs North to South. Anchored by Hvy AT weapon and Hvy Inf weapons with a Nashorn and Jagdtiger being the long archers of the line. I also have a Single Tiger and a handful of StuGs and mostly Non-German Armour after that. So in the 3rd day of the operation and after a rather bleek night battle where i lost a FO point on one of the lesser hills. I decided I should try a counter attack. So I gather up the Tiger, a PzKw II ausf F Kubelwagen and Sdkfz 250/1 with a few small infantry units attached, and begin a dash from my lines to the "rear" of my opponets area by cutting through his weakest flank, which is also my own. So the Kampfgruppe launches it's advance, with the Tiger and PzKw II in the lead in "hunt" and the transport/Troops making there way behind them a bit back. All goes well for about a 100m right before a hill, when a T-70 breeches the top. The Tiger pops that one and a 2nd T-70 comes up, I am thinking oh, recon. Then as the turn continues, a pair of T34C come over, followed by more T34s and a IS-2, at which point i had been back at the MLR(Main Line Resistance) thinking there was a push else where. The smoke from the Pz II alerted me just in time to see my Tiger takes 3 rounds to the front from T34s, knocking out 1 t34 and losing a crewmember. That shocked the Tank and it began to bug out. The Infantry on the back of the Tiger were thrown off, the 250/1 was brewed and it's Plt Leader was sent running to the rear. The Kubel and a Sdkfz 6/2 hit reverse and made it back to german lines safely with infantry streaming in behind them. The only other armour in the area, other than the disabled Tiger, was a S35 and M15 medium tanks, I had used for anti-Infantry duty. I moved them to counter the armour or atleast slow it down, til I got something in the area that could do a counter to it. As the little mites(my term for the obsolete tanks) moved forward, the M15 was damaged by shellfire and withdrew to the rear and the S35 continued alone. Now I was looking for a place to do something to gain some time, so I lauched my 3 StuGs in a mock-counter attack, to lure what i think is the bulk of his armour from punching a hole into my rear. This worked as 1/2 the armour turned north as and as the group drove to where the StuGs were advancing, the tanks passed in front of the my Strong point where the JagdTiger was deployed and thankfully the 128mm did a nice job and KO'd 4 of the 6 tanks. The remaining tanks he had left at the breakthrough point stopped their foward advance and now my Tiger(panic'd and broken) and his Tanks were seperated by a slope of a small hill that was just big enough to ruin both our LOS. and we both stayed like that till the battle timer ran out. My opponent still came out the loser in loses but I lost material, I can't make up in the next 15 battle(or how ever long it take for the op) all because I got a little greedy and thought I could try a small push to shake things up. [ June 01, 2004, 02:24 AM: Message edited by: Panzer_M ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Paulus Posted June 1, 2004 Share Posted June 1, 2004 Well, that wasn't catastrophic, too ... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim Posted June 1, 2004 Share Posted June 1, 2004 Wait... Your Tiger is shocked, and bugged out, but the crew did not bail out. So you've still got your tiger (or you'll get it back a few battles later). Your opponent lost several tanks. You lost a HT and some inf. Where's the problem? BTW: It pays to send some recce before you start your counter. Pushing listening posts ahead in quiet areas early on. Halfsquads, THs or snipers are great for that. Maybe include some in your op. And make sure the op does no consist of 20 battles with 20 turns each where you can not perform recce and exploit your gained knowledge before the battle ends. Gruß Joachim 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer_M Posted June 1, 2004 Author Share Posted June 1, 2004 It wasn't a HUGE mistake, but it was my first combat loses at this point of the Op. And I was just irked cause it was my ichy pants that lead to the loses. My overall KG is mixed LW/WH with a small FJ detachment(Plt) and ranges in skill from Crack Troops to Green field replacements. What is bad is my overall force is less than 300 men total, I am up against a Infantry Battalion with Strong Mech Support in Amrour and support equipment. It was nice when I dropped a 75mm Barrage in middle of a Truck Park in Battle 2, cause I noticed most of the trucks dropping off infantry and then would headback to the rear behind a hill, in the first battle, Good point of having a good LOS on the high ground. Didn't know I am going to get to keep the Tiger, since it routed at the end of the battle and I couldn't regain control of it. I noticed on some crews, loses are replaced? and some are not? noticed a 10.5cm RR lost a crewman in battle 1 and still hadn't gotten the replacement inn Battle 3. also noticed on a vs computer game, infantry loses within a platoon are rolled together, so if I have 3 sqds of men and two take 1/2 loses will they get rolled together in the next battle? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer_M Posted June 1, 2004 Author Share Posted June 1, 2004 btw my favorite tactic was so far I had a hill, with a steep slope facing east, and a gradual one west, so I drop the Tiger and a StuG to the top supported by 3 sMGs and let them do what they do best. Which went all well until a night battle where I lost all the MGs to infantry and had Infantry storm the hill and had to get the Tanks the heck out of dodge. Still trying to think what would be good for close in Infantry Defense. I am thinking Flammwerfer teams or FlammPanzer III in support, I haven't hit a infantry team with a Flammen yet, I have used them to burn fields and houses so I know how they work in the game, but they are effective against infantry? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer_M Posted June 1, 2004 Author Share Posted June 1, 2004 what is a good number of turns per battle? We are playing 20Battles of 10Turn(Fixed) and it does take away from the ability to exploit loses or breakthroughs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runyan99 Posted June 1, 2004 Share Posted June 1, 2004 10 is way too short! I consider 25 variable to be the minimum acceptable length. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Måkjager Posted June 1, 2004 Share Posted June 1, 2004 Panzer_M ... is this a Historical / semi historical or fictional Op that you are working on? I ask as the Jagdtiger did not enter service until the 3rd September 1944 and that unit was the 653rd sPzjg Abt which was based on in the Western Europe. Just some info Regards Måkjager 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirocco Posted June 1, 2004 Share Posted June 1, 2004 Originally posted by Panzer_M: I haven't hit a infantry team with a Flammen yet, I have used them to burn fields and houses so I know how they work in the game, but they are effective against infantry?Flamethrower teams can be very effective on the defence as ambush weapons. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted June 1, 2004 Share Posted June 1, 2004 They are also very effective in forests, as the enemy breaks within a turn, thus saving ammo and lives of your riflemen. GJK can surely attest. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 Does anybody else besides me read of such a zoo of unrelated vehicle types all thrown together pell mell, and find it hard to keep from laughing out loud? I mean, I don't doubt you had fun. But nobody can possibly take seriously the combined arms tactics of getting one tiger, one jadgtiger, 3 StuGs, french tanks and HTs and flakwagens, to work together. Memo to scenario designers. Give us one main AFV type and let us learn what it can and can't do. You can throw in 1-2 types of minor vehicles, 1-2 of each. But the "total dose" "one of everything" is just plain silly. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer_M Posted June 2, 2004 Author Share Posted June 2, 2004 Originally posted by Måkjager: Panzer_M ... is this a Historical / semi historical or fictional Op that you are working on? I ask as the Jagdtiger did not enter service until the 3rd September 1944 and that unit was the 653rd sPzjg Abt which was based on in the Western Europe. Just some info Regards Måkjager Non-Historical. Other than context. There is a history to this "Battle" I am writing and the Jagdtiger is a expermental(hence it's green and low ammo load) that is caught up in the retreat and put to use in haste. Arnhem was one of the first areas Jagdtiger were operational in combat IIRC? Against the British Paras with the 9th/10Th SS Panzer(II Panzer Korp) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer_M Posted June 2, 2004 Author Share Posted June 2, 2004 Originally posted by JasonC: Does anybody else besides me read of such a zoo of unrelated vehicle types all thrown together pell mell, and find it hard to keep from laughing out loud? I mean, I don't doubt you had fun. But nobody can possibly take seriously the combined arms tactics of getting one tiger, one jadgtiger, 3 StuGs, french tanks and HTs and flakwagens, to work together. Memo to scenario designers. Give us one main AFV type and let us learn what it can and can't do. You can throw in 1-2 types of minor vehicles, 1-2 of each. But the "total dose" "one of everything" is just plain silly. The point this is a mixed unit. It's meant to grab whatever the Germans could to throw against the Russian. The French/Italian are security, part of a Anti-Partisan unit, The Luftwaffe/Fallshirmjagers are a Non-Motorized unit with light support weapons. The bulk of the unit is a Motorized Heer unit that is the remains of a PanzerGrenadier and Infanty division, that was been put back together and used to fill a gap. It's call making due in a bad situation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted June 3, 2004 Share Posted June 3, 2004 Sorry, it is just horsefeathers. Fun no doubt. That is all. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kobal2 Posted June 3, 2004 Share Posted June 3, 2004 (could someone explain this French the meaning of "horsefeathers" ? "Something that just doesn't exist" ?) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer_M Posted June 3, 2004 Author Share Posted June 3, 2004 Originally posted by JasonC: Sorry, it is just horsefeathers. Fun no doubt. That is all. What is wrong with that? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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