Sergei Posted December 11, 2003 Share Posted December 11, 2003 Case: In early 1940 Finns gave the "old" Karelia to Soviets. Civilian population was evacuated. Before the new outbreak of hostilities in mid-1941, not much new population had been deported to these areas. Mostly armed forces and related infrastructure. Especially on a wide NKVD guarded special frontier zone no civilians were permitted to live or move. This, obviously, leads you to the conclusion that the grain fields in Karelia were not taken care of except possibly in a very small scale. So when you're making a scenario taking place in Karelia in July 1941, you probably wouldn't want to use the large crops of CM. But little I know about it, as though I have worked as a dairy farmer's help one summer and my grandparents were farmers, I myself have no real knowledge about it. So, if nobody touches otherwise fine fields from spring to the July next year, what will it look like and how to model it in CMBB? Grain, steppe, brush? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted December 11, 2003 Share Posted December 11, 2003 Not an expert, but here is what I would do. Just use Open or Steppe, with a tendency to get very muddy when it is raining. You will get a lot of wild gras seeding itself, but probably not enough to warrant brush as a terrain tile. Grain is not reseeding itself, AFAIK, so there would not be any seeds from last year's harvest in the ground that could come up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runyan99 Posted December 11, 2003 Share Posted December 11, 2003 My sum total of farming knowledge comes simply from the fact that I grew up in Illinois. I sure have seen a lot of fields.... I thought about this one for awhile. I think fields are re-seeded very early in the spring. So, if the fields were abandoned in the spring, that should have been AFTER seeding the fields for the year. Right? Therefore, I think the crops would have returned, although untended. I would use the grain tile, with some brush mixed in to simulate weedy areas. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted December 11, 2003 Author Share Posted December 11, 2003 Originally posted by Runyan99: I think fields are re-seeded very early in the spring. So, if the fields were abandoned in the spring, that should have been AFTER seeding the fields for the year.No, I meant "untouched starting from spring" (March actually, but since nobody even thinks about touching the fields while there still is snow in them, I thought it wouldn't matter). Withdrawal was in March. Plus that the fields were not seeded the next spring either, so they missed sowing for two years. But thanks anyway, I think I'll use steppe terrain to model fallow. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eichenbaum Posted December 11, 2003 Share Posted December 11, 2003 Brush is too large. Plants that grow from seed that was sown the previous year are very small in March, if they grow at all. Maybe you can MOD the softground tiles and use it as agroculture. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_the_wino Posted December 11, 2003 Share Posted December 11, 2003 For recently in-use fields that haven't been planted, soft-ground might be more accurate. This would be especially true in spring conditions, with a high clay content soils and relatively untouched field. If the soils are more of a higher sand content then the bogging issue wouldn't be as great to big with and would decrease as the weather warmed up much quicker as opposed to high clay content soils. At the height of summer the reverse would be true as the high clay soils would set up like cement while the high sand soils are much more friable (more easily fractured, as opposed to making a solid rock-like structure). Even in summer the bogging chances would be increased as the soil wouldn't be as compacted as an open, untouched steppe. Just my $0.02, for all it's worth. [ December 11, 2003, 04:25 PM: Message edited by: mike_the_wino ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tha_Field_Marshall Posted December 11, 2003 Share Posted December 11, 2003 If the fields were never harvested they would reseed themselves. If they were cut the seeds would be gone, hence no volunteer crops coming up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted December 11, 2003 Author Share Posted December 11, 2003 Geez, I never dreamed there were so many farmers in this forum! I'm more interested in infantry cover than bogging chance right now, as I'm working on an infantry only scenario. Also in my case the previous plowing would have been in autumn 1939. So then, how long would you say it would take for a 20x20 square metre fertile soil area to develop into "brush" terrain? Is four summers enough? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Originally posted by Sergei: So then, how long would you say it would take for a 20x20 square metre fertile soil area to develop into "brush" terrain? Is four summers enough? Yes, if the surrounding countryside is of the brush type. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Originally posted by Andreas: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Sergei: So then, how long would you say it would take for a 20x20 square metre fertile soil area to develop into "brush" terrain? Is four summers enough? Yes, if the surrounding countryside is of the brush type. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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