flamingknives Posted January 4, 2003 Share Posted January 4, 2003 In a future version of CM, i'd like to see these shrink, get blocked or otherwise impeded - any small village in CM, BO and BB, is a little maze, except that tanks can drive through almost anyhow they please. It irritates me - especially defending on a built up map, as the mass of housing provides almost infinate, well covered, avenues of attack. Can we see some kind of cover on the same tile as the smaller houses in future CM? Walls/hedges/fences on the edges of the tiles would be good too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted January 5, 2003 Author Share Posted January 5, 2003 Does this bother anyone else? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Björn Eriksson Posted January 5, 2003 Share Posted January 5, 2003 Sometimes when creating maps I need to have many small buildings close together so what I want is a tile with two or more small buildings on it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Byte Posted January 5, 2003 Share Posted January 5, 2003 Well kind of.....your right to say what you say. but it has never really yanked my chain because I consider the grafics representative (probably spelt wrong sorry) small towns in CMBO (I've never been to Russia so I can only speak of the western European scenarios) are nothing like, and would probably only house 1 to 2 hundred people there just too small as a rule of thumb the lack of housing simply makes up for having lots more closer together and the fact that tanks can not move through houses (as they occasionally did)so overall the current system works well. HOWEVER you are right about unlimited avenues of approach thats why I buy (if possible)road blocks when defending 'towns' and built up areas, I do think that scenario designers should consider this more when allocating forces so the prudent defender could channel the enemies attacks. more often a road block is thrown across a road in open country merely forcing a slight delay around it. anyway thats my 2 pennies worth [ January 05, 2003, 09:28 AM: Message edited by: Mr Byte ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.B.Toys Posted January 6, 2003 Share Posted January 6, 2003 Maybe certain house tiles can be coded as if they are also "rough" terrain to simulate houses with "stuff" lying about them such as sheds and woodpiles that would render vehicle movement around them difficult? These can be used together with normal house tiles to create more complex villages etc.? Best, Richard 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted January 6, 2003 Author Share Posted January 6, 2003 More complex tiles would be good. As a matter of comparison I look around relevant areas of my home village (European [british], 1930s and earlier) and there is no way a tank could get between them, and going through them would be folly even in a modern MBT. Where there are gaps (and there are many low level terraced houses) these are frequently filled with trees/walls/small buildings/chocolate cheesecake. It isn't atypical of a European village either. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lumbergh Posted January 6, 2003 Share Posted January 6, 2003 Remember--it's all an abstraction. Except for the cheescake. Although Russians, I've heard, are partial to borscht-flavored cheesecake over chocolate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted January 6, 2003 Author Share Posted January 6, 2003 Abstractions - Bah. You get villages where you can't drive through lines of houses, even in tanks and quite often too. This 'abstraction' means that you can. Huh? Occasional gaps, fine, but not for each house. Russians did go for the chocolate in a big way - vodka goes well with chocolate 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelt Posted January 6, 2003 Share Posted January 6, 2003 It's worth remembering that settlements in Europe look nothing like their American equivalents. American towns tend to be more dispersed, with lots of space around individual houses - even more so today in this suburban era. Village types vary enormously by country, and then by region. But the present villages do not resemble villages in Western Europe. There, most villages, particularly the older parts of villages, have houses adjoining one another or very nearly so. In some cases you couldn't get a tank through there unless you wanted to demolish foot-thick stone walls. Also, gardens and stone walls are often common - there's much more cover around a house than CM suggests. And streets tend to be narrower. The Finnish villages I've seen were more like CM villages, open, with space between houses. Then again, I've only been in the southern part of the country. This does affect tactics. There's is much less cover now than there should be, and as others have pointed out, you can approach a village from too many directions. But villages are about the right size now. A few hundred people would have been pretty common for a farming community in the earlier part of this century. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted January 6, 2003 Author Share Posted January 6, 2003 Size is fine -I've got no problem with that. It's just that villages, at least in W. Europe, tend to be a closely packed nucleus that you couldn't get a tank through with more widely dispersed outskirts. You also have some walled villages/town which are a maze of small, adjoining buildings with narrow streets. The current CM engine doesn't represent these very well, as with the smaller houses thereis always a gap all the way around it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tar Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 Well, making more of the terrain additive would be a helpful thing to have in any engine rewrite. That way you could add roads or buildings to other terrain, instead of having to have pre-constructed tiles with all the possibilities (like the road+clear, road+woods, road+pine, etc.). Having things additive would allow you to put buildings in brush, rough, open, etc. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted January 8, 2003 Author Share Posted January 8, 2003 That'd be good. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ichadwick Posted January 10, 2003 Share Posted January 10, 2003 I agree. Nice to have some building alternatives, especially for urban maps. There are a lot of narrow streets in Europe you can't simulate with the existing terrain elements. While we're at it... why not buildings more than 2 storeys tall?!?!? Ian 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterGoodale Posted January 10, 2003 Share Posted January 10, 2003 Wouldn't this run along the same lines as dynamic LOS? Because if the buildings are destroyed then the vehicle would be able to go between, but if they weren't then it wouldn't. I thought the engine had difficulty with this? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 10, 2003 Share Posted January 10, 2003 I think the goal in the next engine is to have 10 or even 5 metre terrain tiles, which would allow truly European villages, etc. I second the motion for walls and hedges on the EDGE of the terrain tiles. This would allow two terrain types in one tile, and would permit you to put a hedge between two houses without the necessity of the houses being 20 metres apart. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted January 10, 2003 Author Share Posted January 10, 2003 Goodale, is that really you? Not a Grr or angry face in sight, nor a whiff of TNT, molten or otherwise. While we're at it... why not buildings more than 2 storeys tall?!?!? IIRC, the "2 storey" buildings are just abstractions - if you look at the facings they have more than 2 floors. Houses that go on slopes would be good too - you see alot of those in Europe. Oh, and a map tool that tells you if you can't put a terrain item on a square (like putting house on a slope at present). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.