Manpower limits

[Canuck_para]

1) How will this be dealt with? In COS and 3R there was a OoB and even if you had more money you could not buy anymore units when you had gotten all units in the force pool.

2) This brings up another question. Will countries like Hungary, Bulgaria, Finland, etc have enough production points to rebuild their loses or can Germany help out?

3) Can countries like Canada build there own navy since they can build land forces or can they supply money to the UK to build an integrated navy?

[Canuck_para]

After rereading the FAQ's I see my questions 2 and 3 are pretty much answered. They are classed as Allied/Axis minors. When purchasing Axis minors, is this done during the German turn or is there a seperate Axis minor purchase turn so that resources from the minors can only be used on the minors.

[Desert Dave]

And then we have the issue of how many of EACH TYPE might be purchased.

For instance, can the Brits purchase way beyond their historical # of Subs? I am guessing Subs are much cheaper, and behave as regular naval units. Plus you get the benefit of diving. But in the War, they were used by Britain to little serious effect.

Of course Britain will need more capital ships than others -- to secure the transport line to the Middle East, but if subs can attack other subs, than you could just do that.

Also, if you can transport (without threat, and on the same turn) a short distance between your own ports, how does a fleet at Malta attack Italy's intention to reinforce Libya? Seems like you could make it from Messina to Tripoli on one turn (... at least a week in game terms, after all)? Or, is that an automatic response as when incoming bombers are automatically attacked?

[Canuck_para]

I thought I read something about air interception/interdiction of ships, which would make Malta very important. However, if you have an air unit in Malta you can't have a ground unit to defend it.

[ April 26, 2002, 11:48 AM: Message edited by: Canuck_para ]

[Desert Dave]

Doggone, that's right. Sounds like we won't have an air fleet in Malta after all, since an invasion would absolutely be an ongoing threat, so you HAVE TO garrison Malta. With the rules, you have FoW and can hide your intention to transport amphibious units (unlike, say 3R or others where you can see the opponents marines and transports ready to gung ho! in port).

Britain was able to really curtail Rommel in Libya because of that base at Malta.

So, if we are playing Britain, I guess we'll have to keep cruisers or battleships handy to that area.

[Canuck_para]

Malta might be able to have an air unit if certain forts and single hex islands have an inherent ground/defence value.

[Hubert Cater]

Malta does start with an air fleet, and it is considered a fortified hex

[Desert Dave]

Thank the Stars for Canada!

When you really need them, they're always strapped up and aching to go, like in Iran some years back.

I thought about projecting air power with carriers as a solution, but didn't reckon on the fortification rules. But then, you'd have to provide some screening for the (... vulnerable? any ASW, and is their CAP?) CA/CV's.

Which brings up another question -- can naval vessels just steam around in Seas willy-nilly, or do they have to touch base with HQ (... flagship?) units every so often?

[Hubert Cater]

Naval units are also affected by supply, and it is calculated by distance to port. Simulates 'milch cows' for subs and so on etc.,

Supply is calculated a little different for naval ships from land units though, it will be current supply value - 1. So when you leave port ships will have a supply value of around 10, go off in the distance and it decreases by 1 per turn. Come close to port and it will be the maximum value, either supply = distance from port or supply = current supply value - 1. So the idea is to have naval units touch base with their ports every so often as you've correctly guessed

[Holyman]

Do you seriously mean that not more than one unit cant be placed on one hex? With these 50 mile hexes there should be no problem to have both air and land units on the same spot. In High Command there could be something like 15 units on top of each other. So please tell me yo are just pulling my leg?!

/Holyman

[Straha]

Personally, I don't think that the option of stacking units the size of whole armies or corps in a single hex would really be a good idea.

Straha

[Holyman]

But, but... i looooved hicom! Seems kind of foolish not to be able to defend an air unit with some paratroopers...

[Straha]

Hicom was very promising. Indeed, I liked the map and the detailed country layout in Highcom better than in the other games (there was even Luxembourg!)

Sadly it was eventually bogged down like the German army in Russian winter by the totally cumbersome resource allocation/production/diplomacy system.

Straha

[Ancient One]

Originally posted by Hubert Cater:

Naval units are also affected by supply, and it is calculated by distance to port. Simulates 'milch cows' for subs and so on etc.,

Supply is calculated a little different for naval ships from land units though, it will be current supply value - 1. So when you leave port ships will have a supply value of around 10, go off in the distance and it decreases by 1 per turn. Come close to port and it will be the maximum value, either supply = distance from port or supply = current supply value - 1. So the idea is to have naval units touch base with their ports every so often as you've correctly guessed

Are you saying that the supply of naval units is not at all based on their distance to port, but rather on how many turns away from port?

[Desert Dave]

Turns away from port sounds right, since you would expend fuel and supplies even if you were running in circles.

So, it would depend on the resource-size of the port, and if your opponent was always bombing it, from the air or with capital ships, you'd have less supply.

[Canuck_para]

Originally posted by Hubert Cater:

Malta does start with an air fleet, and it is considered a fortified hex

How does an air fleet defend itself from a land attack? Fortifications should not add to an air units defence unless the game considers the air unit to have a "base defence force" included.

[Hubert Cater]

Are you saying that the supply of naval units is not at all based on their distance to port, but rather on how many turns away from port?

It's a combination of the two, can depend on either or and the greater value will be taken. So if out to sea for a long time then it is based on how long you have been at sea, but move close to port and it could be the distance to port depending on the maximum value

[Hubert Cater]

How does an air fleet defend itself from a land attack? Fortifications should not add to an air units defence unless the game considers the air unit to have a "base defence force" included

Each unit type has variable values for soft/tank/air attack and defence etc. So if an air fleet is attacked by ground units it would be considered a base that is in the process of being overrun, so best to keep them out of range of ground units

[Canuck_para]

Originally posted by Hubert Cater:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />How does an air fleet defend itself from a land attack? Fortifications should not add to an air units defence unless the game considers the air unit to have a "base defence force" included

Each unit type has variable values for soft/tank/air attack and defence etc. So if an air fleet is attacked by ground units it would be considered a base that is in the process of being overrun, so best to keep them out of range of ground units </font>

[BloodyBucket]

The raid on Entebbe?

I agree, it is kind of cheesy for an infantry unit on a game of this scale to destroy an air unit. Prehaps a solution would be to have it disrupted and arrive next turn at a reduced strenth?

[Canuck_para]

Originally posted by BloodyBucket:

The raid on Entebbe?

I agree, it is kind of cheesy for an infantry unit on a game of this scale to destroy an air unit. Prehaps a solution would be to have it disrupted and arrive next turn at a reduced strenth?

Yeah, no raid on Entebbe. I went to the place where that raid happened but it should not happen at this level. Godd idea that the unit is removed breifly but comes back at not full cost.

[Hubert Cater]

I understand the concern, it makes perfect sense and it was kept into consideration with the design.

In this game and in most cases air units cannot be destroyed by a single ground unit attacker, would probably take at least 2 to 3 hits depending on the attacking units/experience etc, and also air units do have a strike range, so this can be used to keep them a safe distance from the front lines. If you want to take the chance and strike deep, that is your option but you run the risk of exposure (as you should) and this I would safely guess is keeping it somewhat realistic.

The good news is that the current implementation has never come up as an issue during beta testing (which I hope is a good sign), and I worked the AI to really take care of their air units in this respect as well

[BloodyBucket]

Hmmm... two to three hits to eliminate an air unit.

Since, IIRC, there is no "combined" attack and no stacking, that would mean your air force would have to be attacked by two or three ground units with enough AP's left after other attacks and moves to destroy it. That would mean either

</font>

• A serious hole in your lines </font>
• You put your air unit on the front, you dummy </font>

Since I don't know how many APs a typical unit gets, the chance of a lone wolf slipping behind your lines and gobbling up your air units is probably slim if that number is not great, and the unit must expend APs to attack the air unit.

As to the idea of the air units having an intrinsic ground defense strength, that's fine with me. A fortified hex, like Malta, should give an air unit more staying power against ground attack, as the fortification can represent garrison troops, as well as the steel and concrete types of fortifications.

[ May 01, 2002, 01:06 AM: Message edited by: BloodyBucket ]