MichaelU Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 I'm playing a PBEM at the moment as the German defender against an American attack in June '44, conditions clear and dry. My opponent is advancing steadily and hasn't hit my main line of resistance yet. Imagine my surprise then when an aircraft buzzes in and rockets a panzerschreck team hiding in a foxhole in front of the main town I'm defending. Pretty good spotting, especially considering the team was on the opposite side of a building from the aircraft's line of flight. No other Allied unit was able to spot this team, so it's position couldn't possibly have been radioed in to the aircraft I'm impressed by this pilot's ability to spot the enemy, but not as impressed as a few turns later when it picks out my Fallschirmjaeger squad, which was in tall pines engaged in a firefight 34 metres away from a few enemy squads. A few turns after that, another panzerschreck team, this time hiding in a foxhole in woods, comes in for the same treatment. Once again the team had not been spotted by any enemy units and was well away from the main area of fighting. The only blemish on this pilot's otherwise brilliant record was one pass where he machine gunned some American infantry. Now my gripe is, if hiding in a foxhole, especially in woods, or engaging enemy infantry at close range is not enough to protect against aircraft, what is? Surely a pilot buzzing over the battlefield at 200mph would not be able to spot that well. What really rubbed it in is that another panzerchreck team, also hiding in woods, was able to remain hidden for a full turn from three enemy infantry squads within 10 metres of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelU Posted March 27, 2001 Author Share Posted March 27, 2001 For those smart alecs who are sure to point it out, I know Biggles is not American and was actually a WW1 pilot, it was just for dramatic effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Heinz 25th PzReg Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 That does indeed sound strange and very unrealistic. Heinz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ckoharik Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 Just a thought, but maybe your Schreck teams forgot to complete their concealment from above thus leaving them open to spotting from the air. I have seen pictures of fortifications/dugouts that are totally invisible from one direction but are clearly visible from behind and above. Granted, your particular situation does sound a little suspicious but "it" happens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Sessine Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 That's totally unrealistic and very irritating, but, alas, also very old news. I've always been annoyed with the way airpower is implemented in CM, but if it wasn't, imagine the outcry Just make sure to avoid it in your scenarios (gentlemans agreement?). /CS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelU Posted March 27, 2001 Author Share Posted March 27, 2001 Difficult to avoid airpower when you're playing an operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windopaene Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 Si Senor Biggles... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 ckoharik is right on. If you don't believe him go duck hunting sometime. You'll soon learn not only proper camo but to quit moving around in the blind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamsters Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 Originally posted by Count Sessine: That's totally unrealistic and very irritating, but, alas, also very old news. /CS And that is totally untrue. I've been on an airpower kick for, oh, the last two months, and can tell you that this result was entirely atypical. Rarely do aircraft strafe hidden troop positions and often they'll miss vehicles in scattered trees. What happened was simple bad luck for Michael (And good luck for his opponent). In the last dozen battles I've played with aircraft, I've seen a wide variety of actions from my aircraft, ranging from the most common (Bomb, strafe a couple vehicles, disappear) to less common (Bomb, disappear) to the rare (Don't appear or, the weirdest, bomb and then strafe the same scout car 5 times, scoring a wheel hit each time, which I assume means he was going after the spare on the last run). So, to sum, aircraft don't have an inordinate ability to spot troops but sometimes, sometimes you get a flyboy with a good eye and he ruins your day. Just like, I'm sure, in real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 In an operation I'm currently playing as a German defender, an allied plane showed up a couple of battles ago. I was a bit worried, but he ended up expending all his ordnance on a PzIV that had been knocked-out in the first battle and which was now several hundred meters behind the (Allied) lines. He never came close to attacking any of my live units. ------------------ Leland J. Tankersley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOS was 71331 Posted March 27, 2001 Share Posted March 27, 2001 Given the point cost of close air support and the extremely variable damage it can inflict on the enemy as well as on friendly units, I consider it a poor purchase. The time to buy it is when you're up against a much better opponent. If you're likely to lose without air support, buy it in the hope it will turn the game around. I understand Michael U's dismay at having enemy air take out targets it probably should never have seen. But how much would he have lost if his opponent had purchased the plane's cost of heavy artillery instead and simply fired it unobserved into his deployment area on turn one? ------------------ Airborne Combat Engineer Troop Leader (1966-1968) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucero1148 Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 I've only purchased air suport three times and in 2 games my air support didn't show up. In a op where air support was in the force mix it did show up but got promptly shot down by my opponent's AA units. In the one and only time that my air support did show up for a ME it wrecked havoc on my opponent's AFV's destroying 1 Hetzer and 7 halftracks. All best Patrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juju Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Originally posted by lucero1148: In a op where air support was in the force mix it did show up but got promptly shot down by my opponent's AA units Hehheh *chuckle* ------------------ If your enemy comes to speak bearing a sword, open your door to him and speak, but keep your own sword at hand. If he comes to you empty-handed, greet him the same way. But if he comes to you bearing gifts, stand on your walls and cast stones down on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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