Schwarze Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 I have just bought a book about tanks of world war 2 and i looked up the British Comet Tank and it said it was 77mm, and when i went to play i saw it said it was a 76mm, dont believe me? go here http://www.onwar.com/tanks/uk/fcomet.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schwarze Posted April 29, 2001 Author Share Posted April 29, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Primary Armament 77mm ROQF Mk. II <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commissar Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 Fascinating. I never knew there even WAS a 77mm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schwarze Posted April 29, 2001 Author Share Posted April 29, 2001 Also another mistake! The Challenger tank is a 77mm too, and the game says its 76mm! http://www.onwar.com/tanks/uk/fchallenger.htm <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Primary Armament 77mm 17-pounder Mk.II <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> [ 04-28-2001: Message edited by: Schutzstaffel ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffsmith Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 Darn you Are Correct !! Better return your copy for a Refund and find something more accurate to play : Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 What's worse, the Union Jack is the wrong way round. The diagonal red stripes should be facing clockwise, but in CM they're facing anticlockwise. BTS, fix or do somefink!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Johnson-- Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 For the sake of getting the game out so you guys could play it, BTS took a few shortcuts. I don't know about the Comet, but the Marder III was supposed to carry the Russian 76.2 Gun, but in CM it is a 75mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodyBucket Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 The difference is easily explained by the slight difference in imperial millimeters and decimal millimeters. The British Imperial Millimeter is 1/76th larger than the standard decimal millimeter, so BTS just used the decimal millimeter to express the diameter of the modified 17 pounder gun on the Comet. Another little known fact is the Brits used the cost of their ordnance when naming it. Thus, the 17 pounder costs 17 pounds to manufacture. I hope this clears things up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navare Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Schutzstaffel: I have just bought a book about tanks of world war 2 and i looked up the British Comet Tank and it said it was 77mm, and when i went to play i saw it said it was a 76mm, dont believe me? go here <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> The 77mm gun was actually a modified version of the 17-pdr. "It fired a round with a reduced propellant charge. It was known as the 77mm for logisstic differentiation." Source: Janes Tanks of World War 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 BloodyBucket wrote: > The British Imperial Millimeter is 1/76th larger than the standard decimal millimeter Naw mate, you must be thinking of Airfix military models which are 1/76th the size of the real thing. This would explain the discrepancies in the Comet and Marder, not to mention the Besa machinegun: BTS bought Airfix kits of all the tanks in the game, built and painted them as instructed, and then did all their measurements with a ruler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSpkr Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BloodyBucket: The difference is easily explained by the slight difference in imperial millimeters and decimal millimeters. The British Imperial Millimeter is 1/76th larger than the standard decimal millimeter, so BTS just used the decimal millimeter to express the diameter of the modified 17 pounder gun on the Comet. Another little known fact is the Brits used the cost of their ordnance when naming it. Thus, the 17 pounder costs 17 pounds to manufacture. I hope this clears things up.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> April fools was a month ago. MrSpkr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr. Johnson-<THC>-: ...the Marder III was supposed to carry the Russian 76.2 Gun, but in CM it is a 75mm.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> There are some very good reasons for that. The first is that only the first production run of the Marder used the 7.62cm PaK36® L/51.5. Sometime after the middle of 1942, it was provided with the 7.5cm PaK40/3 L/46. But even supposing some of the earlier models lasted into the period covered by CM, BTS is still right because the Russian guns were rechambered to take the cartridge for the Pak40. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 Actually 76.2 is correct. The "77mm" was a shortened 17-pdr, specifiacally made for the Comet tank by Vickers Armstrong. The cartridge case was both shorter and larger in diameter than the regular 17-lbr. "77mm" was adopted to avoid confusion with other 76.2mm guns, however it was 76.2mm. info taken from Gudgin's "Armored Firepower, the Development of Tank Armament 1939-45" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sturmtiger101 Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr. Johnson-<THC>-: For the sake of getting the game out so you guys could play it, BTS took a few shortcuts. I don't know about the Comet, but the Marder III was supposed to carry the Russian 76.2 Gun, but in CM it is a 75mm.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I agree with Mr Emrys' statement, that CM models and equips the Marder II & III correctly as both of these were only armed w/ the german produced 75mm weapon. It was the earlier Marder I model which sported the captured USSR 76.2mm crash-booms. The first of which was mounted on the Ausf D & E versions of the PzKw MkII chassis, and the later version Marder I on the venerable PzKw 38t chassis. The Marder I was an extremly expedient " fill in the gap " type weapon to quickly deliver better anti-tank killing platform to help counter the T-34 threat until more specialized designs could reach active service. A few Marder I saw service in North Africa, but most production of Is & IIs went to the eastern front. Marder III, both the Ausf H and Ausf M models, served in the west too. Cheers, Eric [ 04-29-2001: Message edited by: sturmtiger101 ] [ 04-29-2001: Message edited by: sturmtiger101 ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Lucke Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 Navare and Tiger are quite correct: The "77mm" gun is just a 17lbr (76mm) with a reduced-charge round. If you check the stats for the Comet in CM you will see that it's gun is rated at 792m/sec, while the standard 17lbr is rated at 884m/sec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Belles Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 Oh, horror, horror, horror!! The Major Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I/O Error Posted April 29, 2001 Share Posted April 29, 2001 Well hell, time to return the game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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