Molotov Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 When is it coming out ??? what will it focus on (the WHOLE east front war or ...)any help would be much appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
109 Gustav Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 It will come out when it is done. BTS hasn't given us any dates more firm than that. Yes, it will cover pretty much the whole east front, from 1941-5. This is obviously going to be a lot more complicated than CMBO's 1944-5. ------------------ Well my skiff's a twenty dollar boat, And I hope to God she stays afloat. But if somehow my skiff goes down, I'll freeze to death before I drown. And pray my body will be found, Alaska salmon fishing, boys, Alaska salmon fishing. -Commercial fishing in Kodiak, Alaska Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmaker Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 Can't wait. The terrain should also lend itself to the full potential of the German guns hopefully. Gonna need it to take on the Russian hordes of thick-skinned T-34s. Not to mention waves of infantry. Does it feel cold all the sudden? P.S. I still want my Brummbars and Sturmtigers! BOOOM! baby, BOOM! ------------------ "Uncommon valor was a common virtue"-Adm.Chester Nimitz of the Marines on Iwo Jima [This message has been edited by Warmaker (edited 02-04-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 Actually BTS said they're looking at a Fall '01 release: http://www.battlefront.com/discuss/Forum1/HTML/015600-6.html ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. [This message has been edited by Gremlin (edited 02-04-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest aka PanzerLeader Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 Yes, it will cover pretty much the whole east front, from 1941-5. This is obviously going to be a lot more complicated than CMBO's 1944-5. And what about my beloved Winter War '39? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illo Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 Yes Winter War!!! Finnish dont have much equipment anyway so no modelling problems there. Just give infantry some Suomi-SMGs and molotov cocktails and russians will have really hard time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barleyman Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 Another vote for Finns! Finnish ski troops or bust! How would you model that anyways.. Have them "limber" (put ski's on) for couple of minutes, then 100% bonus to movement in snow? Hmm.. Better call that 200% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commissar Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 Yes, Id love a chance to battle the Finns and make up for stupid Soviet leadership! Oh, wait, not much to make up with here Skitroops were mentioned to be included by Steve in one of his interviews - Id like to remind everyone that after the Winter War, Soviets used ski troops as well! So dont let the Finns have all the fun Cheers! ------------------ "...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 Originally posted by aka PanzerLeader: And what about my beloved Winter War '39? That's CM4. Loooooooong way from now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francesco Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 I'd like only to see captured vehicles in other hand service- very common in reality (finnish T34, german T34s,) And especially western equipment in russian service. Valentines, Churchills, Shermams, HT, mortars, AT and artillery guns, M3 Lees, Stuarts, Matilda2s and so on..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francesco Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 What about great T28 and T38 russian tanks....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francesco Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 An d T35s...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francesco Posted February 4, 2001 Share Posted February 4, 2001 Sincerly I hope not to see JS3, historically not good.... please, do not make the same error of Microsoft about CC3!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest aka PanzerLeader Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 That's CM4. Loooooooong way from now. It would be pretty ridiculous of BTS to include the Winter War in CM4. I mean, it's much more logical in CM2. The Russians are already there(and not in CM4), and I thought the Finns were to be added anyway, as an Axis Satellite? Am I wrong? I think BTS has to clear some of the mess up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francesco Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 I'd like a lot some tips and hints from BT in order to satisfy ouf angry of CM2 (I'd like only one or two words, like: there will be the T34 in five versions! Or something like this) no more.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 They should post and update a FAQ on it. ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M Hofbauer Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 "hordes of thick-skinned T-34s" I think you are confusing "thick" with "sloped". T-34 armor wasn't THAT thick really - just well sloped. As for the inclusion of the T-35 - BS! I say. you might as well include the Maus, it saw an almost similar widespread use... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 Herr Hofbauer, many of us don't (particularly) care about how widespread something was used historically and would like as many units as possible because of the tactical possibilities. ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Heidman Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 Originally posted by Barleyman: Another vote for Finns! Finnish ski troops or bust! How would you model that anyways.. Have them "limber" (put ski's on) for couple of minutes, then 100% bonus to movement in snow? Hmm.. Better call that 200% I would think ski troops would not be modelled on the CM2 scale. Skis were somewhat useful for getting around in the snow in an operational sense, but I doubt they were used in tactical firefights. Kind of like cavalry really. IIRC, in ASL ski troops that were currently on skis would actually gain movement points when they changed from a higher elevation to a lower elevation... ON another note, I am getting the impression that a lot of the Finn loving public is going to be dissapointed in however BTS chooses to model the Finns. So far, they have stuck to a very generic individual soldier model, without meaningful nationality distinctions besides the actual weapons. If that holds true I predict much wailing and knashing of teeth when the Finss do not massacre Soviets in droves. Jeff Heidman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 Originally posted by Francesco: An d T35s...? Official statement was 'no' - too difficult to model with the different turrets, and not enough use to warrant modelling it. That was the last I read, coming from Steve. ------------------ Andreas Der Kessel Home of „Die Sturmgruppe“; Scenario Design Group for Combat Mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Heidman Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 Originally posted by Gremlin: Herr Hofbauer, many of us don't (particularly) care about how widespread something was used historically and would like as many units as possible because of the tactical possibilities. While I agre with the sentiment in theory, it often presents some implementation problems. For example, one oft-sited wish is for the German Maus tank. Fine, lets say BTS decides to put thta in the game. Now, they are not going to put it in without making sure they get its basic characteristics correct. So, can anyone tell me what the real world speed of that vehicle actually was? How was the quality of its armor? What ground pressure did it exert? How much ammo could it carry? What is its turret rotation speed? Many of thses questions become increasingly difficult to answer for vehicles that did not reach production simply because they did not see enough battlefield conditions to actually evaluate them. So what should BTS do? Guess? Go with (likely) grossly inflated production specs? Jeff Heidman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckMan Posted February 5, 2001 Share Posted February 5, 2001 How about some stuff from the Italy front, is there something coming up. Or is there some mod out there that I dont know about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barleyman Posted February 6, 2001 Share Posted February 6, 2001 chooses to model the Finns. So far, they have stuck to a very generic individual soldier model, without meaningful nationality distinctions besides the actual weapons. If that holds true I predict much wailing and knashing of teeth when the Finss do not massacre Soviets in droves. Oh yes they will AI does a fine simulation of early-war USSR tactics! So just bring on the human wave assaults, my Maxim teams are ready and waiting! (Worse yet, Finnish army was almost all conscript..) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted February 6, 2001 Share Posted February 6, 2001 Originally posted by Jeff Heidman: I would think ski troops would not be modelled on the CM2 scale. Skis were somewhat useful for getting around in the snow in an operational sense, but I doubt they were used in tactical firefights. Kind of like cavalry really. Not quite true. Skis were used tactically and on the CM2 scale. In CM2 it is not very necessary for Finns though, because all the real fighting happened in 1941 and summer 1944. I don't know how Germans or Soviets used them. There the rarity factor should come into effect. ON another note, I am getting the impression that a lot of the Finn loving public is going to be dissapointed in however BTS chooses to model the Finns. So far, they have stuck to a very generic individual soldier model, without meaningful nationality distinctions besides the actual weapons. If that holds true I predict much wailing and knashing of teeth when the Finns do not massacre Soviets in droves. In QB's yes, but in historical scenarios it should be able to model historical abilities. There were many kinds of situations during the war. Soviet veterans could beat Finnish conscripts, although in the early war most Soviets had poor training and no experience. aka.Panzerleader, think of the Poland '39. It won't be in CM2, yet both Germans and Soviets both took part to that campaign. I think it's better to have it in the Early War game, because the tactics used were really something different. And, then it gets to be done with the CM II engine, with multi-multi-play!! Chuckman, Italy will be in CM3 which should handle all the Mediterranean fighting (North Africa, Balkans?, Crete, Italy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apa Posted February 6, 2001 Share Posted February 6, 2001 Yes, Finnish army was almost all conscript, but they were used to living in the countryside, and were even before war a lot in forests during winters, so they might be better modeled as veterans in CM game terms, even though they didn't know too much of the tactical side. But finnish officiers (at least higher ranking officiers) were better than their Russian equivalants, thanks to Stalin... The reason finns were so lot in the woods during winters, is that Finlands most important industry was forest industry, and if you are a farmer there was nothing else to do during winters, than chop some wood... And easily over half of Finlands population were farmers. So if one compares these farmer-soldiers to some troops from areas of Soviet Union where there is almost never snow, and almost no forest, one could easily say that those Russian soldiers were the conscripts, even if they had better training. It is also known fact, that Russian winter equipment wasn't too good during the winter war (a lesson they learned well, and the next one to learn this was Germany during winter 41), and then add some bad tactics and the massacre is ready. Apa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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