gamey area fire against mortars?

[CMplayer]

Is this gamey to the point of being

likely to offend opponents?

My HMG starts coming under light

mortar fire. By looking at the layout

of the shellholes (more a less a straight

line) it is easy to trace a line in the

direction the fire is coming from.

But since we are playing on a fairly

small map, the line goes through open

ground until it hits a stand of scattered

trees right at the map edge (on the opp's

side).

So, of course, I'm 99% sure of the location

of the mortar, and a few rounds of area fire

from a Wespe ensures that my HMG is never

again surpressed by that mortar. Voila,

after the game I find a foxhole there, a

little black tube, and no crew anywhere

to be seen.

The thing is, this seems to exploit the

'gamey' edge of the map, making it too

easy for me to guess where the fire is

coming from. In real life, they could

have been concealed in some kind of

cover farther back, since LOS goes

through scattered trees.

Gamey???

regards,

--Rett

[Slapdragon]

Called Recon by Fire, and it was done all the time.

[coralsaw]

Plus, your opponent had the choice not to put the mortar in an obvious place.

[Guest Mr. Johnson-<THC>-]

It has cost many a game.

[Bruno Weiss]

Maybe it isn't that your opponent is gamey, it is just he isn't as shrewd a tactician as you are. I think it was gamey for the Germans to use up their remaining armor reserves for the Ardennes offensive allowing the Soviet Army to finish its Westward approach unmolested. Plus, Luxembourg was at the edge of the map. In the end though, it worked out quite nicely for their opponents.

------------------

"Gentlemen, you may be sure that of the three courses

open to the enemy, he will always choose the fourth."

-Field Marshal Count Helmuth von Moltke, (1848-1916)

[von Lucke]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bruno Weiss:

Maybe it isn't that your opponent is gamey, it is just he isn't as shrewd a tactician as you are. I think it was gamey for the Germans to use up their remaining armor reserves for the Ardennes offensive allowing the Soviet Army to finish its Westward approach unmolested. Plus, Luxembourg was at the edge of the map. In the end though, it worked out quite nicely for their opponents.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL!

[Brian Rock]

This appears to be a sound and valid tactic to me. I can think of a few real world examples not dissimilar to this.

[aka_tom_w]

decidedly NOT gamey

just good tactics

"maximum use of available resources"

"observe, adapt, and over come"

that kind of thing

sound military doctrine in my book

-tom w

[Guest Seimerst]

Don't think it is "gamey"-- you are merely putting suppresive fire on top of suspected firing positions. I recall being taught crater analysis to get a bearing on the direction of the enemy's mortar/arty for the purposes of counterbattery fire. I realize that you get a pretty good idea of when the fire is coming from quicker than RL but I would not think it unfair your Wespe silenced my mortars trying to surpress your HMG.

[Mannheim Tanker]

Agree that it's not gamey. It would only be "gamey" if it exploited the game engine. I think a lot of people misunderstand what gamey means...

[CMplayer]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Seimerst:

Don't think it is "gamey"-- you are merely putting suppresive fire on top of suspected firing positions. I recall being taught crater analysis to get a bearing on the direction of the enemy's mortar/arty for the purposes of counterbattery fire. I realize that you get a pretty good idea of when the fire is coming from quicker than RL but I would not think it unfair your Wespe silenced my mortars trying to surpress your HMG.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks for the opinions, both to you and

to those others who took the time to figure

out what I was (unclearly) trying to ask

before answering.

My only worry was that it was easier for

me to make a guess about his mortar position

because the edge of the map reduced the

number of likely locations to one. In

real life I might have to expend more

ammo on more suspected positions. That is

why I used the term 'gamey' (exploits a

feature of the game engine, namely the

artificial map cut-off). But as you say,

since it appears to be a real world tactic,

you can hardly expect someone not to use

it, when they are trying everything they

can think of to tip the odds in their

favour.

regards,

--Rett

[Dr. Brian]

IMO, this is 100% "gamey." That doesn't mean I'm saying not to use it, in fact, I will try to in my gaming future.

But, as it appears to me, the game engine and game restrictions (i.e., map edge) were used, therefore, not "realistic" and hence gamey.

However, I applaud your innovation and insight into exploiting this! I like it.

------------------

Doc

God Bless Chesty Puller, Wherever He Is!

[Pak40]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dr. Brian:

IMO, this is 100% "gamey." That doesn't mean I'm saying not to use it, in fact, I will try to in my gaming future.

But, as it appears to me, the game engine and game restrictions (i.e., map edge) were used, therefore, not "realistic" and hence gamey.

However, I applaud your innovation and insight into exploiting this! I like it.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I disagree, this is not gamey at all. In real life the men on the battlefield could hear incomming fire, use a watch to time the sound of the round fired to the explosion on the ground, then estimate the bearing. This will give any artillery personell the means to calculate an appoximate area of where the artillery piece is located.

I'm not sure how effective this is with mortars on the battlefield but it could be done. My guess is that mortar sounds can be heard several hundered yards across open ground.

Also, his main piece of evidence was that the mortar craters showed the direction in which the mortar was firing from. This could be determined by any man on the battlefield and is therefore not gamey.

The use of the map edge is the only "gamey" part about his evidence but, as others have stated, his enemy should have set his mortar in a safer less conspicuous place.

In my opinion he used good deductive reasoning and took a gamble at wasting a few precious rounds from his Wespe. His gamble paid off.

[Wilhammer]

Cannot be gamey.

This is counter battery fire. And we did not think CM simulated this

Recon by indirect observation.