Most Overrated Military Commander of WWII

[CombinedArms]

I'm guilty of starting the "Worst Military Commander of WWII thread"--and a lot of you seemed to have fun with that-- so I thought I'd respond to that discussion by posting a "most overrated" (and also a "most underrated") thread.

Rather than stick my neck out with an intial view on "most overrated"--I thought I'd get the ball rolling by citing the rather

"pop" "Reader's Companion's to Military History's" rather amusing chart on the Ten Most Overrated Commanders. Four are WWII Generals: Guderian, MacArthur, Montgomery, and Patton. Remember--this isn't my list!

FYI, the other names on Reader's Companion list are: Atilla the Hun, Joan of Arc, Montcalm, R. E. Lee, Vo Nguyen Giap and Norm Schwartzkopf--the author seems eager to offend readers ecumenically.

This book also has a worst list, with three WWII figures: Hitler, Mark Clark and Maurice Gamelin (Fall of France, 1940).

So, come on guys and gals. What are your views?

[Panzer_Meyer]

Hi,

IMO,Patton, Montgomery, Zhukov.

[Grisha]

Zhukov was overrated. While vital in 1941 at both Leningrad and Moscow, Zhukov's command abilities were limited and even crude. Still, he was a man who would fight to the end and with great determination. And, more importantly for Stalin's sake, Zhukov was politically reliable.

[Viceroy]

FWIH my vote would go for MacArthur.

[Mr. Johnson--]

MacArthur

[Rupert_2]

My vote goes to....Patton or MacArthur,then to Sir Arthur'Bomber'Harris( Monty's a good choice too, ) or Zhukov and 'Vinegar Joe' Stilwell.

If it's only one vote, mines Patton !!

[VonHeinrich]

My vote goes to "Bomber" Harris.

I read an article not long ago about this "gentleman". Apparently he ignored the signs and the officers that told him bombing Berlin only was a waste of resources. Instead he sent vast amounts of young kids and expensive planes to Berlin just because he had an idea - a wrong one - about winning the war. The result was, not surprisingly, shot down planes and dead crews - and a lot of untouched German factories. What a jerk!

[CombinedArms]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rommel22:

Hi,

IMO,Patton, Montgomery, Zhukov.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd like to say a word in defense of Patton. Look, all three of these guys were heavily hyped. Monty was IMHO a huge pain in the butt but at least a half-way decent general, with genuine strengths counterbalancing his oft-cited weaknesses. Still, the word over-rated does seem to apply in his case--if someone so often termed overrated can still actually BE overrated. I don't know enough about Zhukov, specifically, to make a qualified judgment on him.

But I would argue that while Patton was heavily hyped--obscuring other generals who may have deserved more attention than they got--he was nonetheless a very good General. He was vastly egocentric and emotionally quite immature, but he also knew how to motivate troops and he was a hard figther and master of exploitation warfare. He had a learning curve when his troops hit strong static defenses around Metz, but he eventually mastered that too. His finest hour was getting his troops so quickly up north in relief of Bastogne (he had already had his staff develop plans for this before they were needed). And he was probably right that the correct way to counter-attack the Bulge was to cut it off at the base.

[Hilltopper]

How are you defining "worst"? Worse at tactics, the worst at table manners? Worst at everything? If it's everything, I'd have to say Hitler. He was a complete knucklehead. Remember, he had placed himself as the Supreme head honcho in charge of every thing militarily. So in a few words, he sucked hard in tactics and everything else related.

[Rupert_2]

Originally posted by CombinedArms:

I'd like to say a word in defense of Patton. Look, all three of these guys were heavily hyped. Monty was IMHO a huge pain in the butt but at least a half-way decent general, with genuine strengths counterbalancing his oft-cited weaknesses. Still, the word over-rated does seem to apply in his case--if someone so often termed overrated can still actually BE overrated. I don't know enough about Zhukov, specifically, to make a qualified judgment on him.

But I would argue that while Patton was heavily hyped--obscuring other generals who may have deserved more attention than they got--he was nonetheless a very good General. He was vastly egocentric and emotionally quite immature, but he also knew how to motivate troops and he was a hard figther and master of exploitation warfare. He had a learning curve when his troops hit strong static defenses around Metz, but he eventually mastered that too. His finest north in relief of Bastogne (he had already hour was getting his troops so quickly up had his staff develop plans for this before they were needed). And he was probably right that the correct way to counter-attack the Bulge was to cut it off at the base.

Yeah. but you could say the same thing about Monty !!

[Mr. Johnson--]

Just look at Patton's Kill ratios, they speak for themselves.

[Rupert_2]

Yeah, a bit like Theodore Eicke then eh ??

[Barton Hick]

My vote for most overrated of WWII goes to MacArthur or Montgomery. I disagree with Patton, however, as in many situations where the Allies used plans other than Patton's, they lost more men then they would have using his plans (studies of the strategies during WWII, such as during the retaking of France, seem to show that we should have listened to Patton). Plus, he was the only one prepared to counter-attack the Germans during the Battle of the Bulge. Sure he was a dick and he was cocky, but I think he was good. Plus, he help father the armor tactics and philosophy in America in WWII.

[StellarRat]

I wouldn't vote for McArthur. He had a excellent loss ratio (US soldiers lost vs. Japanese soldiers lost.) From what I've read his kill to loss ratio was the among the highest in the war. It's been a long time since I read that, so I can't quote the source. His defense of the Phillipines was incredible. Also, the Inchon landing was a master stroke that saved the UN forces in Korea. Sure, he had a huge ego, but he was good.