M. Bates Posted January 14, 2001 Author Share Posted January 14, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>I think this movie would be extremely interesting if they actually used German and Russian actors speaking in German and Russian with subtitles. It would make for a more authentic movie, avoiding the entire hollywood garbage by using 'established' actors.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I disagree with that completely. This film will likely be a better acted and interesting film than the German production in the early nineties. Anthony Beever didn't have to write in Russian to make his account authentic. Done in any other language, no one would go to see this film, making it a financial and artistic failure. In any case, a truly authentic film of this kind of warfare would not be allowed into cinemas, the extreme violence etc. just wouldn't be allowed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Panic Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 von lucke wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> I don't know about ya'll, but I get the impression this movie will be more about how poor Russian peasant becomes a Hero of The Soviet Union against his will and then just another cog in the political propaganda machine, rather than an actual "war movie". <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Most war movies are also about something other than war. This one looks like it has enough "war" in it to make it a war movie. ------------------ Two Rules to Live By: 1. Never Get Out of the Boat. 2. Charlie Doesn't Surf. [This message has been edited by General Panic (edited 01-14-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Panic Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 If you look at the entry on imdb.com, you notice an interesting fact: a lot of the minor russion roles are being played by Germans (or at least the names look German). Sigh, it's too bad CM2 won't be out in time for this movie. ------------------ Two Rules to Live By: 1. Never Get Out of the Boat. 2. Charlie Doesn't Surf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilhammer Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 What happened to the real sniper? Stalin had, shall we say, a strong dis-like for anyone taking any recognition that might steal some attention from him. Marshall Zhukov was sort of shuffled off into oblivion after the war. In other countries he would of become a prime national leader candidate. Stalin had a saying that someone on this board uses as a sig, "No Man, No Problem", which was practiced with a ferocious appetite by him. How many "Heroes of the Soviet Union" would be gulaged or shot after the war just to protect Stalin from his paranoia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Bates Posted January 14, 2001 Author Share Posted January 14, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>If you look at the entry on imdb.com, you notice an interesting fact: a lot of the minor russion roles are being played by Germans (or at least the names look German).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> It is filmed in Germany, and all the extras are German. In Anthony Beever's report from the film shooting, he said that the extras playing the Germans and those the Russians did not get along very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CeeJee Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 What happened to the real sniper? According to the book Enemy at the Gates, Vassili Zaitsev's sniper career ended after 242 kills, when he was injured by a mine. After the war he became director of an engeneering school. Enemy at the Gates, by William Craig shows very well what a horrifying battle Stalingrad really was. Urban combat eats up anything thrown into it, even an army of 250,000 men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScoutPL Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 I can never get over how everyone gets upset when hollywood makes a movie with a historical(hysterical) context. Thats all it is guys. Context. Everything after that is just ticket getting eyewash. You should look foward to going to the movies to get entertained, not educated. Otherwise you will be continually disappointed. I doubt there's anybody in the world that could come up with the budget or the knowledge to really portray the house to house struggle of stalingrad as it was seen by the average panzergrenadier or guards rifleman. NO way! So quit sounding do disappointed when hollywood keeps making movies to sell tickets to teenagers, rather then make a film that is faithful to what really happened. If it really concerns you, buy stock in The History Channel, get a controlling interest and make them start making little historical movies, thats the only way it'll ever happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Stars Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 well, time to chuck in my two cents..... criticism of the trailer aside, let's face it:how many english-speaking eastern front war films have ever been made? the only one i can recall is the much lauded Cross of Iron directed by sam peckinpah in the late 70's(?).So even if it does keep the gimmicky things in the plot (wierd pause before death effect, babes of Stalingrad, etc.) be mindful that generally the public is not interested in Soviet versus Nazi conflict so the fact that it was made with anything close to a 100 mill budget is a miracle unto itself. I mean, the average american(non-grog) isn't generally thrilled of the concept of grueling eastern front warfare(evil nazis kill evil commies...wheres the harm?)... as for it more of a statement film instead of a war film, i doubt it. while the fact that war scenes in a film does not a war film make( legends of the fall, Dr. Strangelove, Slaughterhouse Five, etc.), Dive-bombing stukas and mass city bombings aren't staples of your average "talkie"-type movie. so my overall point is:if it's a WWII movie, see it(even Pearl Harbor:Ben Affleck finds love among strafing Vals). Because I sure don't want another WWII movie drought like the one through the 80's-mid 90's...... P.S. the "evil Nazis, evil Commies" is not an opinion of author, so save your Flamethrowers.....(although Nazi and Communist REGIMES in WWII definitly qualify for "Evil" in my book....) ------------------ "Life is pain. Anyone saying otherwise is selling something." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Stars Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 oh, and another thing( haven't posted in a while so i have a lot to get off my chest ) Don't knock the love story part either. yes, I doubt a woman of such lovelyness would be mucking around the Barrikady. And yes, most sexual relations between women and men in battlefield situations are generally not of the romantic type, let alone mutually willing.let's face facts:love in war is probably at best a prostitute, at worst..rape or worse. But before you raise your fists in Grognard-induced Furor, let's think of the Positive: Good-looking woman + Good-Looking Guy from Gattaca = Love story. Love story = Average Female's favorite type of film. Average Female's favorite type of film = You actually might have a shot in hell of convincing your Girlfriend /Wife / Concubine /Mistress to actually see this movie with you. So don't get your Combat Webbing in a twist and surmise that you can probably stomach a half-hour/hour of Romance if you wedge 1 and a half hours of guns, explosions, entrails, mayhem and cool-looking uniforms around it. And remember,as a grognard, note that the problem of your significant other not enjoying your blood-thirsty hobby is a common malignancy for us all (except maybe Kitty, for which we all must hit our knees and pay homage and worship her).so take advantage... ------------------ "Life is pain. Anyone saying otherwise is selling something." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medlinke Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 Someone mentioned this movie costing more than it did...Actually...I read a few months ago that this film is the most expensive film ever made in Continental Europe. Pretty impressive if you ask me. I think that we are an entirely different audience of movie goers from the average John and Jane out there. For instance, everyone knows that in SPR the tanks in the final scene are conglomerations of many different tank parts. To everyone else, a tank is a tank and if it's big and noisy that's all that matters (I agree...the noisier the better!) Regardless, think of the movies that have been listed on these forums as ones that people are actually really enjoying. Now look at that in conjunction with all the war movies ever made...Will this one live up to those standards? Probably not. Will most people care if it does? Probably not. Will it matter to people here? I hope so. There is a fine line between showing people lies and framing a movie in a dynamic historical setting. A movie about Stalingrad for the masses probably won't show the conditions well (aka the babe being clean) but will it matter? I know my fiance sure as heck wouldn't go and see it if there wasn't some chick aspect to the film, so it's a nice tradeoff. I think waiting till it comes out will be a good idea as to how it will be. Although, having CM2 out then would be nice too, because no matter how sick of it you were, you could come home and fight Stalingrad at home....Not that I'm anxious for it to come out! Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forever Babra Posted January 14, 2001 Share Posted January 14, 2001 Okay, it has been years and years (and some more years) since I read William Craig's Enemy at the Gates, but I seem to recall Zaitzev having a romantic involvement during the battle. Am I correct, or am I mistaking him for someone else? If I remember rightly, she was gravely wounded. ------------------ My P-47 is a pretty good ship And she took a round coming 'cross the Channel last trip I was thinking 'bout my baby and letting her rip Always got me through so far... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricochet Posted January 15, 2001 Share Posted January 15, 2001 I listened to a book (it’s the 21st century after all) called War of the Rats by David L. Robbins that deals with the Zaitzev story and the Battle of Stalingrad. At the end of the book there’s an interview with the author who actually went to Russia and interviewed Zaitzev. There was a girl, a fellow sniper, I forget her name, in Stalingrad that Zaitzev had an affair with during the battle and was gravely wounded at the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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