billcarey Posted January 3, 2000 Share Posted January 3, 2000 I have read the numerous threads on terrain and elevation, but have one more question: How representative of the elevation system are the three demo scenarios? For my first scenario I am going to design I want to build a river running through a gorge with mountains on both sides. How tall will I be able to make the mountain and how deep the gorge (with reference to the hills in Last Defence and Riesberg and CE)? - Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L4Pilot Posted January 4, 2000 Share Posted January 4, 2000 I don't know about the rivers, or other "water hazards," but the gallery of screen shots at CM HQ definitely shows some steep slopes of the type you are describing. I think these were in the snow scenes section of the screenshots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted January 4, 2000 Share Posted January 4, 2000 CM allows you to have two heights for elevations, 2.5 meters and 5 meters. There are 20 elevation levels, so you could create a height difference of 100 meters max. That pretty much covers any area of the theater CM is simulating, including the hilly Ardennes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted January 4, 2000 Share Posted January 4, 2000 Just to put it in perspective with the demo, Last Defense used the 2.5 option with (I think) 18 levels used. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcarey Posted January 4, 2000 Author Share Posted January 4, 2000 So I can get about twice the height difference that LD has? This is going to be a nasty scenario! A river in a gorge, a small town, and a road running along the side of a mountain. A couple of panthers, some SPW 251s 2 german VG companies, and some FTs. All the allieds get is 2 armored cars, pair of zooks and 1 company. Basically, it will boil down to who can use the extreme terrain better This game (beta demo) is the coolest. Like the new forum too. - Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 4, 2000 Share Posted January 4, 2000 Umm I think that the maximum terrain elevation difference in LD is only about 30 metres or so... I think you should be able to get about 3 times the height difference at least... I'm playing some mountain scenarios now and those mountains are big, big obstacles, winding roads, forested sides etc... Bil's armoured column is gonna pay for fighting through there ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcarey Posted January 4, 2000 Author Share Posted January 4, 2000 Is there a movement penalty for moving up or down hills? I would think you would get tired going either way. - Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 4, 2000 Share Posted January 4, 2000 I haven't played any really mountainous scenarios yet (I'm only going to start this one tomorrow against Bil) but troops move more slowly up slopes. I presume that this slower movement will tie in to fatigue occuring more quickly (in terms of distance but perhaps not in terms of time). Not sure though. I think this is for Steve. ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted January 4, 2000 Share Posted January 4, 2000 Yes, there are movement costs for going up slopes. At some point they become so steep that they are not scalable for vehicles and/or troops. In one cool little scenario I did up I had the 5m option and LOTS of steep slopes (put elevation 20 next to 10 and you get a straight 50m cliff for example). There was this one huge hill that troops could go up/down on, but just barely. Vehicles? Forget about it Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcarey Posted January 4, 2000 Author Share Posted January 4, 2000 Definitely a penalty for going up hill I would think, but my real question is: Is there a penalty for gowing *down* hills? I have done a not insignificant amount of walking over very hilly ground (without people shooting at me) and I have found that going down steep hills is almost as tough as going up them. Any info on this type of movement? - Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bil Hardenberger Posted January 4, 2000 Share Posted January 4, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Bil's armoured column is gonna pay for fighting through there<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I like how you spell armor... I suppose you spell color; colour, and aluminum; aluminium! How do you spell lose? louse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 5, 2000 Share Posted January 5, 2000 Actually I usually just say "Bil" as a shorthand for the word lose. Around my house the name Bil is shorthand for a no-win situation or an infinite loser . As in "Wow, that guy had a Bil's chance in hell of making that shot" or "Uhoh, there goes a Bil", usually followed by a sharp thud as the aforementioned Bil fails miserably at whatever he was trying to do and falls flat on his ass... but, I guess I don't have to tell you about that do I Bil, you're quite aware of the losing streak that is your life eh? Take that Mr Hardenberger ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bil Hardenberger Posted January 5, 2000 Share Posted January 5, 2000 Okay Fionn. I was sending you a gentle jibe, and you take that as an attack? Very well, send me the setup file, enough stalling! Let's settle this like men. Bil (1-1 against Fionn PBEM) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest kevi Posted January 5, 2000 Share Posted January 5, 2000 Hey Guys - When I think of hilly terrain my design mind heads right to Italy. Is there anything you think that will prevent a historical scenario based in Italy prior to Overload? Some of the peaks were over 1000 feet, other not. - Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted January 5, 2000 Share Posted January 5, 2000 Thank you Fionn! I have been having a less-than-pleasant day at work (I had to take the morning off while my stomach debated just coming out altogether ) Anyhow, reading your use for Bil lifted my spirits a lot (and repays him for fighting me to an almost EXACTLY-equal-score-draw in CE) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 5, 2000 Share Posted January 5, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>I was sending you a gentle jibe, and you take that as an attack?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well God knows that if I waited for an in-game attack from you I'd die from old age . I've become used to little jibes being the most vigorous and driving attack you can put together, it carries over . <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Let's settle this like men.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Umm, ok, *Fionn takes ruler and...* What? Oh, you meant on the field of battle eh? Sorry Bil but the only kind of settling you should do is into a comfy chair to watch us "young uns" fight it out Remember Bil, the one thing you can't allow me to do this time is to psyche you out. Remember that ok? ... This time try not to get rattled as an entire flank of your attacking force crumbles into impotence... something I'm sure you're INTIMATELY familiar with . Now THAT, gentlemen is some quality taunting ... <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Bil (1-1 against Fionn PBEM)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Fionn who conveniently is gonna hide behind the fact that the scenario wasn't finished . The addition of an extra victory flag behind Bil's front line would really have given me a victory I swear . Ps. Bil, any chance of you doing your setup and then sending it to me? I'm not gonna get to setting up my forces until tomorrow since I need to plan all those interlocking fields of fire around the ambush zones I'm setting up and it takes me a long time to set up ALL those German guns in perfect positions. ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 5, 2000 Share Posted January 5, 2000 *Taps foot impatiently on ground while waiting for Bil to consult with some witty associates and draft and redraft a witty "spontaneous" come-back.* Now THAT is quality taunting ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bil Hardenberger Posted January 5, 2000 Share Posted January 5, 2000 Sorry to disappoint you Fionn. I refuse to respond on principle. This will be my last post on this subject. I refuse to get into this type of public display, which just feeds your ego. See you on the battlefield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 5, 2000 Share Posted January 5, 2000 Ooh, looks like someone took the taunts seriously instead of seeing them as the jokey taunts they were.. ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 6, 2000 Share Posted January 6, 2000 Ah, it's all sorted out now.. Nothing to see here.. Go back to your homes people ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcarey Posted January 6, 2000 Author Share Posted January 6, 2000 Still, no answer to my original question (although the taunt fest was interesting. I still think I could whoop up on both of you combined and write an AAR to prove it.) Is there a movement penalty for going *downhill*. It's no big shakes, I just think it would make the game a little more realistic for steep slopes which I plan to use alot. - Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 6, 2000 Share Posted January 6, 2000 Short answer is that I don't know for sure so was leaving it. Long answer is that most probably the same movement penalty applies going downhill as applies going uphill. You wouldn't want to quote that as gospel but that seems a reasonable guesstimate to me. You'd really have to ask Steve or Charles to be sure though. ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aacooper Posted January 6, 2000 Share Posted January 6, 2000 The way it looks to me, you adjust the elevations of the SEAMS between the TILES? Is that how it works in the editor? One improvement to shoot for in CM2 might be to reduce the allowable tile size (or have a variety of tile sizes for ease of making gigantic Russian battles) to better simulate little creeks (or "cricks" in my neighborhood) that might be 2 meters wide by 1 meter deep. They are similar to trenches, and would be an obstacle to some vehicles. The drainage ditch on the side of the main Reisberg road is fairly broad, for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullethead Posted January 6, 2000 Share Posted January 6, 2000 Steve-o (hey, it's hockey season ) said: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>There was this one huge hill that troops could go up/down on, but just barely. Vehicles? Forget about it<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Do different vehicles have different hill climbing abilities? For instance, those very low JPz things with the long guns sticking way out front... they'd have trouble with steep slopes. And I've read that the Sherman, despite all its well-known faults, could climb steeper hills than almost any other tank. -Bullethead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Capt_Manieri Posted January 6, 2000 Share Posted January 6, 2000 Finally, a dispute "I" didn't accidentally start....wow. I'm losing my touch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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