How can we make CM a huge success?

[DEF BUNGIS]

I was sad to see the last thread closed, although some people were getting hateful.

Anyway...I just happened to stumble upon a link to Battle Front when I was looking to buy a new WAR GAME. Digging thru link after link, it's a miracle I found out about it. It sure doesn't get much Preview hype any where.

You can't even find the game on most gaming sites!

I guess that has to do with the what BTS talks about in the INDUSTRY column.

Basically, I want WAR GAMERS to know about this game, and what BTS is doing for us.

This game should apeal to any war gamer, not just the hardcore. It will benefit us all for more people to know obout CM. It surely can't hurt. And I'm sure the bigger turn in profit for BTS, the more excited about CM2 or 3 they will get. I don't have any special suggestions, but I just post URL's and any other information about the game on all strategy game sites I visit. Hopefully, togehter, CM will get a huge fan base.

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Better to make the wrong decision than be the sorry son of a bitch to scared to make one at all

[Guest mch]

Perhaps OT..

I was wondering if BTS was working to overhaul the CM section on the homepage;

showing new textures,features,etc...

I personally remember my first impression of

CM being..so/so(until I D\L'd the Demo!)

And I have heard people I've "word of mouthed" to say nearly the same thing.

remember.."the beta demo is so..yesterday"

but,in any case..just keep telling them!

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It is no disgrace to be defeated...It is a disgrace to be surprised.

-attr.to Fredrick the Great-

[Guest MantaRay]

Well, on my Swat 3 site, i have talked about CM almost as much as I have Swat 3. Sad part about it is that there is nothing to talk about with this game so my site has suffered. When the multiplayer comes out in August, I may be too bored to care. Sierra really sucks.

But I will keep plugging CM, even though my friends are not into Wargames. Atleast I have an average of about 250 people visiting my site a day...so there is hope for more unlikely conversions

Ray

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SWAT 3 Page

Panzer Elite(not up)

Combat Mission(comming soon)Page

[Mark IV]

I think most of the computer WAR GAMERS already know about it- they're just waiting. Combat Mission swept comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical like a platoon of Ferdnands when the demo was released, but there has been little more to say about it since, other than (you guessed it) "when's the release date?" Most of the on-topic chatter moved here .

The challenge now might be to attract other serious gamers to the wargaming genre. CM has enough visual appeal to stimulate the interest of folks who haven't tried wargames, and is accessible enough to reward those with any aptitude at all with some success.

Lots of people have a sincere interest in WWII history, but think war games are either "silly" or too complicated. The same people may spend their lunch hour blasting demons to gel with chain guns, or building sim-civilizations, etc.

Close Combat reached a lot of those people, because it was Microsoft-propelled. Can the CM Cult do the same, by word of mouth-net?

[Major Tom]

I think, when the reviews for the finished version of CM are in and the high praise that the game will recieve (Possibly some 100% ratings) the people who have just bought another game with so many bugs it is unplayable will go and order themselves a copy of CM just to get a good working game with infinite replay value. My brother just got the new Lucasarts Star Wars Game, he loves Star Wars, but, was willing to admit it SUCKED and he will take it back.

Too many people are sick of buying unplayable games with little replay value. Possibly people who have never showed any interest in wargames will see the review, see that it is totally unbuggy, look at its graphics and attention to detail and will order the sucker. So many people went to see SPR who don't like war movies, solely on the fact that it was a greatly shot movie with a tangible script.

CM will be the SPR of computer games. Just wait for the reviews of the game to come out, then sales will increase. We as individuals cannot do anything other than to tell people we know about the game.

[William Thiel]

I can assure you that CM will be very well received on the Mac side, and I am sure it will get plenty of free publicity, as that is most Mac-o-philes' modus operandi. Whether it does well on the PC side is another thing entirely, but quality tends to shine through and I am sure it will do so in this case.

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Men make wars. Boys fight them.

[Colin]

CM already has been well received on the Mac side. There have been lots of new headlines and articles and things and all of them have been well received.

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Visit my webpage!

http://cm4mac.tripod.com

[DEF BUNGIS]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mark IV:

Combat Mission swept comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical like a platoon of Ferdnands when the demo was released,<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

MARK IV

What is this?

A web site?

Never heard of it before.

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Better to make the wrong decision than be the sorry son of a bitch to scared to make one at all

[DEF BUNGIS]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Major Tom:

I think, when the reviews for the finished version of CM are in and the high praise that the game will recieve (Possibly some 100% ratings)

Too many people are sick of buying unplayable games with little replay value.

We as individuals cannot do anything other than to tell people we know about the game.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Possibly, especially in GAME PLAY and REPLAY VALUE.

You got that right. I bought ULTIMA ASCENSION, the game was so buggy, ORIGIN released 3 patches and eventually sent all registered buyers a whole brand new INSTALL CD. Talk obout alot of pissed off people...

I have full confidence in BTS.

I will tell as many as possible.

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Better to make the wrong decision than be the sorry son of a bitch to scared to make one at all

[CoolColJ]

That's why BTS need to the time to polish up the game, all this bitching about when the game is gunna be released won't help. The first game you release creates the lasting impression, so you need to make it count.

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CCJ

aka BLITZ_Force

My Hompage ----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj

Double your immersion with my Tweaked Textures and Saving Private Ryan sound set mods for CM!! Check out my new Textures V2.0 photo Gallery and my music while your there, or grab a CM Wallpaper!

[Guest Big Time Software]

Hi all!

The best way to help us out is, oddly enough, to just play and talk it up. Tough job, but someone has to do it

Seriously, the more people are playing and discussing the game, the more the word gets around. Reviews are also going to be key as well as other more traditional PR routes. But playing the game, discussing it, recommending it to friends, supporting the websites that support CM, etc. is the best way to go.

As for updating our website... after we release I will give it another facelift. However, since Madmatt and Fionn have been doing Comabt HQ so well (combathq.thegamers.net) there really isn't a pressing need. New stuff goes up there daily and it covers a much broader range of support than we have the time to do.

Steve

[guachi]

I've been spending time looking for good WWII websites to use for the CMMC. I probably have about 100 bookmarked for later look-sees. Some are not actually relevant to the CMMC but are interesting nonetheless.

Several of the sites have been particularly outstanding. I've e-mailed the designers telling them that I really liked the site, found it informative, and why I was there. I give a one or two sentence blurb about CM and invite them over to battlefront.com to check things out.

I've only done this with three sites so far, but I plan on doing it with more when I get a chance. Even if you don't particularly like the site, you can lie just to flatter them and then tell them about CM.

I want to particularly hit re-enacting websites. Most are quite well done with some spiffy color pictures (Nothing like seeing a SdKfz 251 or SPW 222 in action).

Of the three people who I have e-mailed, all three replied within a day and thanked me for visiting their website. None were particularly interested in CM for various reasons, but it can't hurt to at least mention it.

So BE ON YOUR BEST BEHAVIOR! We don't want new faces coming here and seeing sniping going on here. Leave the sniping to your electron-powered sharpshooters.

Jason

[Mark IV]

Def: You serious? Humor takes many forms, here, lately...

comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical is a (the) Usenet newsgroup devoted, more or less, to historical wargames for the PC.

Assuming you're genuinely curious, and don't normally frequent newsgroups, you could search for it on www.deja.com. And believe me, the CM demo got the best buzz a game could in that very tough forum.

Folks there are as hot for a CM release as we are here (lots of crossover, I'm sure). They are also the most likely to rip on: poor documentation, bugs, ahistorical shortcuts, bugs, patches, postponed released dates, bugs, lousy game editors, unfulfilled promises, bugs, ditzy AI- you get the idea.

Some hope, and some fear, that CM will be... the Grail. Most were just plain impressed.

[Guest Big Time Software]

Thanks to all you guys for helping us get the word out. Combat Mission will sink or swim on the strength of word-of-mouth from players.

Ironically, once the game is out, it might help us most to have you spend more time on other websites besides this one. Not that we want to chase anyone away! But rather it's the only way to reach new people who haven't heard about Combat Mission yet. So, if you have the time and inclination, please frequent other gaming/discussion/news sites and try to chat up CM and drum up interest. It would be great to see discussions spring up in a bunch of different places across the net.

It's not such a big issue at the moment, but once the gold demo is ready (and it won't be too long!) reaching new gamers will become very important. And then we'll have something concrete (the gold demo) to show them too, not just promises.

Thanks again! We couldn't do this without your support.

Charles

[Guest PeterNZ]

I don't have muhc fiath in reviewers myself. Used to work in a games shop and read every magazine, and each one would have it's ditzy reviewers who seemed to spend more time picking their nose than they did getting to grips with some games, (that deserved better mentions).

Of note was Computer Games Strategy Plus (or something), damn fine magazine. Anyway, it's really up to us to get people into it and to make them give it a chance. I think the best way to do that is multiplayer! Nothing like blasting your mates plans to crap .. then single player will also get addictive for the convert.

PeterNZ

[DEF BUNGIS]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mark IV:

Def: You serious? Humor takes many forms, here, lately...

comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical is a (the) Usenet newsgroup devoted, more or less, to historical wargames for the PC.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh....

OK, got it now.

I never spent to much time on news groups.

They really get on my nerves. No moderations, All the bitching and whining back and forth, trolls, etc.

That's why I didn't know.

I have really been out of touch with historical war gaming for quite some time now. The last I palyed was TALON SOFT, BG ANTIETAM, before that was ASL the board game.

And hell...that was 4 may be 5 years ago.

Hopefully, CM can get me caught up quickly, along with all the other smart people here.

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Better to make the wrong decision than be the sorry son of a bitch to scared to make one at all

[guachi]

Speaking of other website discussion areas, does anybody (BTS?) have a list of possible discussion areas to check out?

We could then form commando infiltration teams and drum up interest. We could even have a set script:

Commando 1: Does anybody know of a good WWII computer game?

Commando 2: Check out Combat Mission from battlefront.com It is a {insert game description here}

C 1: Thanks! I'll check it out.

{Comes back next day}

C1: WOW!! CM is a great game! I really liked {insert list of cool features}!

C2:Glad you liked it!

{Repeat ad nauseam until CM has one million sales}

Jason

[Guest R Cunningham]

Reading this thread, something occured to me.

Since CM will never be sold in stores, it will never go in to a bargain bin either. This probably isn't signficant in the near term, but how many games from the big publishers get sold this way? How many people out there wait for the bargain prices versus the people who can't wait and buy immediately? And how many wil never pick up CM simply because they don't want to pay full price for any game regardless of quality?

[JeffRaider]

I'm with you, guachi. Just tell me where. . .

Commando 1, out.

[Guest Big Time Software]

The Bargin Bin is an artificial overhead and inventory control mechanism that has nothing to do (in theory anyway) with the game's quality. A great game can wind up in the bin for any number of unrelated reasons. Of course crap winds up in the Bargin Bin, but that stuff never should have been released or released at full price to begin with People used to buing $45 quality games (as opposed to $45 junk) for $30 just because the publisher decided to dump the product, they are going to have to get used to the new reality.

Combat Mission is worth $45 today, and it is certainly worth $45 6 months or longer from today as well. The passage of time does not make CM LESS of a game. The notion that spending 2 years making a game and having a 3 month full price selling window is not something we buy into.

The bargin bin thing cuts both ways, from what I can tell. Retail products are pushed off the shelf so quickly that many people can't buy a particular game easily if they hear about it say 6-12 months after release. Not true for the big sellers of course. But since we have NO pressure to either stop selling our stuff or firesale it, our marketing window is measured in years, not weeks.

This is one reason we aren't overly worried about getting massive attention on the day we release. Our plan takes into consideration that we can take our time selling CM so we don't need to fear getting tossed off the shelf as soon as we release. Man, abandoning retail is such a joy

Steve

[Hakko Ichiu]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by R Cunningham:

Reading this thread, something occured to me.

Since CM will never be sold in stores, it will never go in to a bargain bin either. This probably isn't signficant in the near term, but how many games from the big publishers get sold this way? How many people out there wait for the bargain prices versus the people who can't wait and buy immediately? And how many wil never pick up CM simply because they don't want to pay full price for any game regardless of quality?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I expect that once CM2 is released BTS will offer CM1 at a discount price to attract new players.

Ethan

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Das also war des Pudels Kern! -- Goethe

[Keg]

[This message has been edited by Keg (edited 03-27-2000).]

[Username]

I think BTS should market CM1 to the worlds militarys when CM2 comes out. I believe TACOPS has done the same thing.

If it were up to me I would jack up the price on CM2 once CM1 has shown itself to be a crossover success. But I am just greedy I guess. I think 55 bucks sounds right.

Lewis

[DEF BUNGIS]

I don't see how people would be interested in a game over 1 year old. You know, someone is alway's pushing the new stuff into our face.

Someone would really have to understand the type of marketing BTS is trying to do and how they feel thier product should be presented to sell for full price after 6 months.

I personally have never purchased a game over 3 months old. I read the preview, get hyped, watch it go gold, read some reviews and make the purchase.

It's like any other retail product, the minute you buy it, it's out of date.

But hopefully with CM all that is about to change..........

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Better to make the wrong decision than be the sorry son of a bitch to scared to make one at all

[Ron]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>I don't see how people would be interested in a game over 1 year old.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, but each of the planned CMs will cover a different period of the war. It isn't as if each CM will be the same old with a new twist, they will each be unique in their own right. Assuming BTS supports their products, which I'm confident they will, implying a game is inferior or not worth the full price simply because it's 2-3 years old would be false. From what I've seen good wargames and perhaps good games in general have a much longer life than the latest trend on display in a retail store.

Ron