Super Grunt Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Not even one damn drop of blood..? If anyone here thinks that not showing any blood on war games is realistic or fun for that matter, yer lyin. I already seen some past topics of why BTS is not showing any blood and let me tell you, IT'S LAME!!! Yet, everyone says, oh...OK I guess that's a good enough reason for me. Or, well I'm gonna buy the game anyway cause it's the best thing going. Yer playin a squad and platoon level combat here! To me, it's all just defacing the hardship and actual brutal bloodshed of the people who took part in this enormous war. You wanna know why nobody wants to buy war games any more? You wanna know why the war game community is so small? Have a look at all the Talon soft war games (no blood), look at SP, CM, PW, and so on, and so on. Hello....ding..ding...ding... Why the hell do you think the CC series were such a hit, it's one of the only damn war games on the market to show some kind of reality, pain and suffering on the battle field. No, I'm not a troll, and if this thread gets deleted, so be it! Go on steve, delete it. Delete this thread cause it's the truth and it's going to start trouble. But, I know damn near %99 percent of the gamers buying CM want to see some blood on the battle field. Don't lie to yourself! Do a search and see for yourself. I know probably no one will respond to this thread for fear of getting banned, but I hope people make thier voice heard for following war games. Love SUPER GRUNT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gyrene251 Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Showing blood isn't necessary for game play so why show it? There's enough of that in those shoot 'em up games. And the reason I didn't buy any Close Combat games was because of the "real time" play. I just don't have the time to play them. I go more for strategy and tactics in a turn based environment. I guess I am a hold over from the old board game days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Heh... supergrunt... I am getting very... "suspicious" about your real identity. You are long enough reading this forum to have noticed the discussion about blood (months ago), and yet you assume that Steve is going to delete such a thread? Even more, you think anybody is going to get banned for responding? Hmm... Anyway... on topic: if you have read the past discussion you know the reasons why there is no blood - it might make the game possibly illegal in some countries (German, the second largest game software market worldwide for example), it adds to VRAM limitations, it adds no game relevant information and it opens a can o' worms ("hey, you show blood. Why not show some brain parts flying around, too? Hey, it's realistic!") So what other reason than to troll do you have for posting this? Getting bored with the forum? Wanna stirr up some §#/! ? That's trolling in my book... [This message has been edited by Moon (edited 04-26-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS_PanzerLeader Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 This topic has been debated heavily and there are lots in favor of blood - myself included . BUT The topic is closed for now as BTS ruled it out for the current version I think the manner in which you posted leaves a lot to be desired - It is definitely a troll in my book what else could this be?? quote: Go on steve, delete it. Delete this thread cause it's the truth and it's going to start trouble. But, I know damn near %99 percent of the gamers buying CM want to see some blood on the battle field. Don't lie to yourself! Sorry man I'm on the side for blood and i take issue with your tact considering you are a junior member and new to the forum - this is a pretty poor start ------------------ SS_PanzerLeader.......out [This message has been edited by SS_PanzerLeader (edited 04-26-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEF BUNGIS Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Yo, Yo, Yo,.... wazup wit dat Yo Why you gotta act a fool. ------------------ Better to make the wrong decision than be the sorry son of a bitch to scared to make one at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Madmatt Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 A). Why would Steve delete this post? He has NEVER deleted anyones post. . Why would someone get banned for replying to your message? No one has ever got banned for simply replying in a thoughtful and mature manner. C). There are many flight-Simulators which are 'heavy hitters' in the military gaming market which don't show one drop of blood. In fact B17-2 which should be out shortly won't have any blood and I challenge anyone to show me where you will find more gore than the insides of a flying fort after a cannon round exploded inside the cockpit or a flak round BIP's (Burst in Plane). D). When I see a burning hulk of a tank in Combat Mission I am smart enough to make the connection and realize that inside someone was immoliated by fire and died fighting for his country. I don't need pretty pink and red pixles to tell me that story. If I want that I will fire up Unreal Tourny or Soldier of Fortune. And those are both excellant games BTW. I just think that adding buckets of gore, like you have suggested, in CM isn't going to add anything and possibly detract from the main focus of the game. E). I think you have some valid points but I am not sure they apply to the wargammer audience at large. I don't remember there being any 'gore' counters or chits in ASL or in any micro-armor game I played yet both of those did and still do have huge followings. Military gamers by and large are after a much different experience than what seeing your squadmates intestines splattered all over a wall would instill. These games give us the chance to match wits against either a human or AI in a duel of skill and ability within the confines of historical accuracy. Its the ultimate extension of WHAT IF and thats why I game. Do I need to see some guys head explode like that Colonel in Glory? No Do I think something like that is cool? Sure, and thats why I play those other games I mentioned above but it doesn't neccesarily fit into the context of Combat Mission and to me would add nothing to the tactile experience of the game. F). One last point, while it is obvious that war is bloody and violent don't be too swayed by the media's depiction of it. Blood more often than not seeps from bullet impacts and not splatters like in the movies. Unless a rather large blood vessel is penetrated you won't find the showers and fountains of blood that you think you would. Not to say it doesn't happen, its just not as frequent as most people think. Try and locate some actual combat footage and watch what happens when A body is hit by a bullet. They tend to slump over as the body tries and deals with the shock. Not very exciting stuff but then thats real life. Madmatt... ------------------ If it's in Combat Mission, it's on Combat Mission HQ! combathq.thegamers.net [This message has been edited by Madmatt (edited 04-26-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Hi SG, <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Super Grunt: No, I'm not a troll, and if this thread gets deleted, so be it! Go on steve, delete it. Delete this thread cause it's the truth and it's going to start trouble. But, I know damn near %99 percent of the gamers buying CM want to see some blood on the battle field. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> first of all, you are a troll. Second, no true blue wargamer ever needed blood on the battlefield. Wargames are a challenge for the mind (you know this word?), and not a Texas chainsaw massacre. Anyway, startup da good ole' Doom and have some fun, but leave us adults alone... All IMHO. Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tom w Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 wow what a rant Its good to voice your opinion, and I would say it truly is a sad commentary on our society and culture if what you are suggesting is true about how blood sells video games. I'm not sure that you are correct. Myth II is one BIG RTS Blood bath and I don't know how well it sold. Ok if its new worthy they say if it "bleeds it leads". That's sad too. I suspect CM will move forward without blood anyway. There is something to be said for taking the moral high road on this issue I think. Good work BTS! When I first played the Demo I thought, its a Demo "no Blood" maybe later. But I don't miss it I think they stated there is no blood in the release version either. It won't detract from the tactics and game play in my opinion. If you are right about the lack of blood hurting sales figures for the game (hard to prove I think) then that is another issue BTS can deal with. -tom w <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Super Grunt: Not even one damn drop of blood..? If anyone here thinks that not showing any blood on war games is realistic or fun for that matter, yer lyin. Love SUPER GRUNT <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
przy Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Hey, we got Doom and those kind of games if you are interested in blood n guts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ol' Blood & Guts Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Now everyone, let's say it together.. A-S-S-H-O-L-E-! The reason that they aren't showing blood, every soldier, and dead bodies IS because of computer limitations at this time. Maybe in a couple more years by the time CM4 comes out and everybody is using 2 Gigahertz computers, then we'll see every man represented. ------------------ "Fear is the path to the Dark Side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering." --Jedi Master Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 OB&G, right on target! Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEF BUNGIS Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Madmatt: I think you have some valid points but i am not sure they apply to the wargammer audience at large. I don't remember their being any 'gore' counter in ASL or in any micro-armor game I played yet both of those did and still do have huge followings. Military gamers by and large are after a much different experience than what seeing your squadmates intestines splattered all over a wall would instill. These games give us the chance to match wits against either a human or AI in a duel of skill and ability within the confines of historical accuracy. Its the ultimate extension of WHAT IF and thats why I game. Madmatt...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Madmatt, you hit it right on the nose bro. I think war gamers (true war gamers) are looking for the historical, what if...the chess like game, and the fun of meeting people with the same type of stragetic interest in WWII gaming. Concerned a little about graphics and such, but mainly concerned about game play and the challenge. This guy sounds like a little teenie bopper who's mad because Diablo II isn't released yet. Hey Super Flunk, get back to your class now and get off the teachers computer. ------------------ Better to make the wrong decision than be the sorry son of a bitch to scared to make one at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tom w Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 ok.. re: cpu limitations But I prefered my "moral High ground" theory better. no Blood? No big deal I'm not sure profanity is necessary here? -tom w <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ol' Blood & Guts: Now everyone, let's say it together.. A-S-S-H-O-L-E-! The reason that they aren't showing blood, every soldier, and dead bodies IS because of computer limitations at this time. Maybe in a couple more years by the time CM4 comes out and everybody is using 2 Gigahertz computers, then we'll see every man represented. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark IV Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Steel Panthers sold quite a few copies- no blood. Age of Rifles? No blood. Most war games- no blood. And of course, with a three man representation of the squad, splashing blood on one man representing a third of the squad is more unrealistic than not showing it at all. (smileys detained for questioning) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ol' Blood & Guts Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Asshole--Troll? What's the difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Sabot Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Gentlemen, I too share Moon's suspicion about this guy's identity. Although i can't tell who he really is, something tells me i read his stuff before. Don't get caught up in his little game. There is only one reason he'd submit a post like that. Notice how he dared Steve to get involved, or to challenge us to respond. No question in my mind, he wants to play games. My advice is to treat him like you would all like him, just push the lever and watch him circle the bowl on his way out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tom w Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 re: the profanity... be careful OB&G's thought police might be after you for contributing to the deliquency of a minor... (sounds like he's half way there already) -tom w P.S. so, super grunto, How's that Cold war project going? <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ol' Blood & Guts: Asshole--Troll? What's the difference? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyamoto Musashi Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ol' Blood & Guts: [The reason that they aren't showing blood, every soldier, and dead bodies IS because of computer limitations at this time. Maybe in a couple more years by the time CM4 comes out and everybody is using 2 Gigahertz computers, then we'll see every man represented. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Yep yep... how would BTS do it under the current system? wait til 4 guys of the 12-man squad are dead or injured and then make one of the three representative guys explode in a red cloud? Soldier of Fortune is cool (even though I'm on a Mac and can only watch my brother play it), but I don't think blood belongs in this sort of game. I'm just as anxious to get it even with the "unrealistic" deaths... so there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scott Clinton Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Hmmmm... I just checked my 'ol collection of AH & SPI board games and for the life of me I can't seem to find ANY 'blood'... I even checked the dozen or so sets of miniature's rules I have and guess what, no blood. That would seem to reflect at least one of the difference between wargamers and gamers in general. We are interested in tactics and strategy, not in gore for gore's sake. ------------------ Please note: The above is solely the opinion of 'The Grumbling Grognard' and reflects no one else's views but his own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted April 26, 2000 Share Posted April 26, 2000 Well, if this were April 1st I would think this was an April Fools joke, because it is nothing but a laugh. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Why the hell do you think the CC series were such a hit, it's one of the only damn war games on the market to show some kind of reality, pain and suffering on the battle field.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Oh boy. If you REALLY think that the little spots of red sold that game, I don't even know where to put you on the scale of informed opinion. Some where down around "nutcase" if I were to be kind. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>No, I'm not a troll, and if this thread gets deleted, so be it! Go on steve, delete it.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> If you aren't a Troll, I am the Queen of England And I just did a quick check of my pants and my bank account and it seems to me that I am in fact not. So you then must be a Troll. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Delete this thread cause it's the truth and it's going to start trouble.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I didn't delete the other couple of hundred posts on the topic of "blood", so I have no idea why you are so sure that yours will be deleted. But since you obviously are in irrational sort, and are in fact Trolling harder than anybody in recent memory, I am closing up this thread. But be sure with the fact that it is because you have opened up the floodgates for people to abuse you, not because there is something inhernetly wrong with the discussion. A quick check of this BBS will back me up on it. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>But, I know damn near %99 percent of the gamers buying CM want to see some blood on the battle field. Don't lie to yourself!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Man... my ignorance meter just went off the scale here with this comment. I don't have to lie to myself. I *KNOW* 99% of people buing CM are doing so because they want the best game out there. If they really wanted blood and guts they would stick to Quake. And with that... I close up this Troll thread in the interests of keeping this BBS discussing things in an intelligent and rational way. Steve P.S. Even though I think some people's opinions expressed here are right on the money, try to at least candy coat the truth and not use profanity to describe this post. P.P.S. Scott, LOL! Good point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts