rocketman Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 A bit of feedback for @Imperial Grunt who I think made this battle. SPOILERS******************************************************************** I had three instances of the AI bunching up vehicles in weird ways. First three T-90s almost merged, they were so close, and was immobilized by precision arty. Then all three taken out by one (!) shot from an Abrams. At another location three BMPs bunched up very close together (also merging) and was all taken out by a few bursts of Bradley autocannon. Finally, in a third spot two BMPs bunched up (so close that the UAV I had spotting only saw one) and was both taken out by one round of precision arty. I have screenshots I can send (can't upload due to Photobucket's recent "business practice"). I have seen this kind of behaviour before, a long time ago in RT, but not sure what causes it. Perhaps too small zone for the AI to go to? I also have saves if that would be of any help. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperial Grunt Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 hour ago, rocketman said: A bit of feedback for @Imperial Grunt who I think made this battle. SPOILERS******************************************************************** I had three instances of the AI bunching up vehicles in weird ways. First three T-90s almost merged, they were so close, and was immobilized by precision arty. Then all three taken out by one (!) shot from an Abrams. At another location three BMPs bunched up very close together (also merging) and was all taken out by a few bursts of Bradley autocannon. Finally, in a third spot two BMPs bunched up (so close that the UAV I had spotting only saw one) and was both taken out by one round of precision arty. I have screenshots I can send (can't upload due to Photobucket's recent "business practice"). I have seen this kind of behaviour before, a long time ago in RT, but not sure what causes it. Perhaps too small zone for the AI to go to? I also have saves if that would be of any help. Unfortunately this is due to a mechanic with the AI and this had been brought to the attention of the powers that be. I used multiple zones in the AI plan to create additional random movement per AI plan and to create a more realistic deployment. When it works, it works great, but in rare cases...all of the units are sent to a single point and the AI does not deconflict that, which causes that weirdness. I have also observed that with large zones, there is still a chance that the bunching occurs as well and the AI does not spread out the units equally inside that zone. But, units do weird stuff even in real life, and bunching up happens all the time on the battlefield... Units know its wrong and possibly deadly, but it still happens. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketman Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 Thanks for the explanation. Granted that units IRL bunch up, but in the game they more or less fuse together and overlap each other. Big immersion killer unfortunately. Maybe it will be fixed down the road as it is a known issue. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 On 2017-07-11 at 7:31 PM, Imperial Grunt said: Unfortunately this is due to a mechanic with the AI and this had been brought to the attention of the powers that be. I used multiple zones in the AI plan to create additional random movement per AI plan and to create a more realistic deployment. When it works, it works great, but in rare cases...all of the units are sent to a single point and the AI does not deconflict that, which causes that weirdness. I have also observed that with large zones, there is still a chance that the bunching occurs as well and the AI does not spread out the units equally inside that zone. I do not recall this particular scenario ( i might not have played it even ) but i think this describes fairly well what can happen when the AI is left a bit to much in controll... Things are quite random...sometimes they work...sometimes they don't ! When using larger AI groups (or perhaps better put...AI groups with multiple units) combined with decent sized/split-up order locations things gets very tricky and unintuetive imo when it comes to designing good (and consistantly working) AI-plans. Like Imperial Grunt explained above ( if i understand correctly )...both options worked as intended SOMETIMES ! - Using a split-up orderlocation with multiple seperate tiles...Worked sometimes when the AI decided to spread the AI groups units in a good way onto the 'painted tiles'... Next time the AI may not be quite so 'clever'...but rather decide to squize several of the AI groups units into one ( or a few ) of 'the painted tiles' Resulting in the failed AI movement described by Rocketman... This seems to be completally random...No way of knowing how the AI will handle the next order location in 'this' playthrough... - Using a large (connected) orderlocation will see the same problem...As mentioned by Imperial Grunt. Sometimes the AI may decide to spead the AI-groups units out in a clever way inside the order location...Next time it might not but rather decide to bunch them all together in a corner of the orderlocation....No way of knowing...and no consistancy at all... I'm sorry for nagging about this ( i have mentioned it before in other threads ) but i think that we really need more AI-groups (32)... In this particular scenario it might not have been a lack of AI groups that made the designer decide for these types of AI-groups but some other reasons (i don't know)... I'm not saying that every scenario should have every single vehicle or every single infantry squad as a seperate AI group...but having the option to reduce the size of the AI-groups would be an amazing improvement imo... It would for example give the designer far better controll of an advancing armour platoon if each tank (or pair of tanks) could be a seperate AI-group... Better timing...better movement...better possitions... and ABOVE ALL...CONSISTANT AI-BEHAVIOR... There would be no more zig-zagging forward amongst the platoon while advancing through multiple order locations...No more bunching up ( atleast more seldom, hopefully) There would be no more random AI placement at the order locations...Each individual tank could be made to find the best possible ( according to the designer ) location at each seperate oder location...etc... The benefits of more AI-groups are many !, many ! , many !.... And scenario designing would bennefit greatly from it...The AI would become way more intelegent...A very, very GOOD thing i think. Please, please...Can we have more of these... 'little beatiful groups'... /RepsolCBR 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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