Been away since Gustav. Advice please

[W1ndy]

Well Im back and keen to play Combat Mission and would like some advice.

 

Im trying to decide between Red Thunder and Black Sea.  Cant justify both right now and its better to play one hard and learn it .

 

This is in the RT forum, but I wonder if anyone has both and can give some idea of what they like about either.,

 

I was going to get RT but Black sea looks very good too.

 

Are they both with the x3 engine ?  

 

What are the big differences that I will notice coming from Fortress Italy Gustav Line , and the big differences between each game?

 

Any comments or responses are welcome at this stage 

Edited February 9, 2015 by W1ndy

[76mm]

It's really pretty simple, I think--what do you find more interesting WWII or modern?

 

Although Black Sea sounds like a great game, I doubt I'll pick it up; I'm just not that interested and modern and don't have enough time to play the games I've got...

 

It's good to have these kind of decisions...

[womble]

They're both on v3. Red Thunder introduced that iteration of the engine.

The differences between v2 and v3 are small, but packed with taste... It's not the leap that v2 was from v1. Some Quality of Life, some clamoured-for features. Command lines so you can tell exactly which subunit is in C3 of its parent HQ is a nice QoL addition. Tank riders are in, though I don't know if that persists into BS (or that you'd want to [have people riding on your|be a person riding on] armour in that environment). A biggie for v3 was the addition of the capacity for flame units, which appeared in RT, and were added later to BN in the vehicle pack. Control of TacAir is removed in RT, and all v3 games only let an observer call in one mission at a time (plus a light observer UAV, I gather, in BS), but allow you to gang your arty modules together into the same mission.

If I had the time and money to buy either right now, I'd go for BS, because it's such a radical departure from the WW2 environment, from what I've seen. Everyone gets some splendid toys to play with and there's a whole new world of tactics out there to get your head round. Though the allure of Tankodesantniki, SMG platoons, Su-152s and JS-2s is admittedly attractive.

[Pelican Pal]

A lot of it is personal preference. Personally I have both and am having more fun with CM:BS. Although I find the style of gameplay that is on offer is more to my taste. You can have small battles against very heavily armed forces, large battles with ATGMs and MBTs engaging at 2+ KM, effective air support, battles against irregular troops. Like generally I think you can have more varied battles in it.

 

It would be easier to give you advice if you gave us more of an idea of what you want/ are interested in.

 

Edit: So I'm working on a primarily infantry only scenario in CM:BS, and I guess I'll describe what I enjoy so much in it.

 

A Company of Ukrainian Separatists supported by some Russian recon troops are attacking a pair of isolated Ukrainian checkpoints.

 

At 300 Meters the Russian recon infantry are spotted. The Ukrainian troops and Russians begin exchanging fire. You have these long bursts of LMG fire and pot shots from the AK-74s flring back and forth. Occasionally someone gets hit. As the firefight gets within 200-250 meters of the Ukr checkpoint the fire intensifies. Grenade launchers start firing, and an occasional RPG-7 or RPG-26/29 round is shot off.

 

So you have these bursts if tracers flying at each side and an occasional grenade or RPG round sailing over the troopers heads. It is suddenly much more lethal. An RPG round hits a tower at the checkpoint. Some Ukrainians are wounded, their body armor saving them from death, but 2 of them do go down. The fighting moves closer and the GP and RPG rounds are getting noticeably more accurate. While the rounds don't often kill large number of troops it is causing wounds and slowly reducing the Ukrainian troops.

 

Ammo and men are both getting low so a decision needs to be made. Retreat into the core of the checkpoint and prepare for a knife fight or start retreating to the other checkpoint. Retreat is chosen. The men leave the heights of the compound and starting leapfroggin through the outer trench line of the checkpoint. Covering each other with automatic fire. Bullets whiz past and RPG rounds land nearby. Occasionally a man is hit, but most of the wounds are not debilitating. Although occassionally a man goes down. This running gun battle lasts until the surviving men manage to make it to the second checkpoint and they prepare for a second round of fighting.

 

The core of it is that you have these really lethal weapons combined with solid body armor. So you can have these lengthy running gun battles where you tense up as you here the tell tale whoosh of an RPG being fired, but unless the rocket is landing nearly on top of your men it will probably only lightly wound them and surpress them. You get an awesome fireworks show and ample time to maneuver your men.

Edited February 9, 2015 by Pelican Pal

[Zveroboy1]

I am a huge east front fan but I am going to have to go with Black Sea.

 

RT is a good game but I find the scope a bit frustrating, only three months is a bit too limited for me even though obviously a lot happened in this period.

I haven't played all of the scenarios in RT, a third if that, but they didn't thrill me all that much. In comparison, the BS scenarios have all been top notch so far, really well crafted, interesting situations and lots of replayability.

 

At the end of the day, it depends on what you prefer, modern or WWII, but I'd say get CMBS now and wait for RT when a module is released.

[W1ndy]

These responses are much appreciated.

 

To answer Pelican Pal, I'm keen on armor conflicts more than infantry tactics. Mainly because I'm not too good at using infantry and need to work on that. I love tanks at range. 

 

Thanks womble for the round up of x3.

 

I'm a huge eastern front fan too but I'm going to go with Zeverboy's advice I think and go for Black Sea.  Jumping form x2 to x3 and then adding all the new weaponry and tactics needed will make a real culture shock, and probably engross me more.

 

Then certainly  head back for Red Thunder in a few months or so.

[Blazing 88's]

...RT is a good game but I find the scope a bit frustrating, only three months is a bit too limited for me even though obviously a lot happened in this period.

I haven't played all of the scenarios in RT, a third if that, but they didn't thrill me all that much...

 

Umm...  I assuming you have not tried this Kursk campaign, Thunder Over Ponyri V2:

http://community.battlefront.com/topic/116495-new-file-at-the-repository-thunder-over-ponyri-v2-2014-11-07/?p=1553455