Friedrich_der_2

You have to be strong when Russia enters war. IMHO there some basic rules: </font> Be fast as Axis! </font>Concentrate your troops on a few points/front lines, so that you have a local overweight. </font>Concentrate your MPPs for the most important units. A corps is cheap but without support from a HQ it is only a waste of MPPs. </font>To resist against Russia you need enough MPPs every turn so captured some countries to get enough industrial (MPP) resources when Russia attacks. </font>Kill units instead of damaging them if possible. Reinforcing is much cheaper than building a new unit! </font>Invest in research because on long term it will bring you much advantages. Investing in industrial technology is always important. Than invest at least in one or two other technologies to improve your troops. Mostly jet technology is important but it depends on your strategy. </font>Read the manual carefully </font>I attack Denmark in the first round. After Poland and Denmark are fallen I concentrate most of my units in the fight against Lowlands and France. I send a smal squad (1 HQ perhaps 3 or 4 ground units and an air fleet) to Sweden and than Norway. Normally they return to Germany when Russia attacks (and they gaind lots of experience). After France is fallen (which should happen fast against the AI) you can attack France Vichy or just Spain and than Porutgal (they fall fast with a squad of 1 HQ and 5 units). Another squad can attack Yugoslavia (or you wait until it will join Allies) and then Greece. Normally than Russia will join Allies in spring 1941 but if you watch carefully their war readiness you are prepared (a straight line of of armies/corps with HQ backup is not easy to destroy especially with some air backup). At this time you should have another Italian squad (HQ + 5 ground units) and some more German units at the eastern front. Often you can attack Turkey than which gives you the chance to capture the Caucasian area of Russia. With breaks the neck of the Russian war machine and therefore the neck of the Allies. If you are very fast and if you have enough air fleets you can attack England after France is fallen. But this is a little bit risky I would make it after you have enough experience. You will have lots of options against the AI with some experience. Good luck! Sven [ January 04, 2003, 11:48 AM: Message edited by: Sven1969 ]

Sorry Seawolf this is not true. Even if you take a look into the Microsoft Encarta you could learn more about this time. From 1871 until 1918 Germany had a paliament, a chancellor and an Emporer. The emporer had more rights as today in the European countries with a king. The parliament had fewer rights which changed later in this time. First the politics have been very liberal but later the socialist party were forbidden and a few years later again allowed. There was a stalemate between emperor and parliament. Not what we would call a real democracy today but do not forget. Womens were not allowed to vote in most countries including the USA and Germany until 1918/20! France allowed womens voting in 1944! And England had not a free equal vote for all citizens until 1917 as Germany and most other countries had not too. Do not compare today with hundred years ago. Germany had some selfmade problems as most problems of nations are selfmade. We had 800 year the sacred Roman empire of German nation. A great power with the emporer who always claimed to be the successor the ancient Roman Caesar. But I think this not now really off-topic. I did not said Hindenburg was Thomas Jefferson. But the Weimarer Republik definitly was a democracy with free secret votes for all people. Yes of course the Aristocrats and the Industry tried to influence the government, but that is done every day in the USA today or how do you explain the "Micky Mouse Copyright Extension Act"? It was a weak democracy but the president Hindenburg had more power than the USA president today. Please take a look at a history book before writing somthing about history... I do not think this excuses to start a war or killing jews! But the situation in Europe was much different from today. Germany and France have been in war for nearly 200 years before WW2 started. Poland did not exist very long as nation, some former German areas were gone to Poland and Russia after WW1, millions of people did not lived in their homecountries. We had a very unstable situation. Sorry for beeing off-topic but it isn't that easy like some people think. Europe was always a powder keg. This has changed after WW2 and I am happy about it is now. Sven

Oh it was a democrazy like the most democrazies at this time. Chancellor Bismarck introduced a lots of social laws. The social system in Germany is based on this principles until today. Also a lots of civil law were passed which has been very advanced. The Weimarer Republic was an free democrazy but to free for that time. Germany was in a big crises because of the world crises in the 20s and because of huge reparation payments which crashed the whole republic. It was only a question if the nazis or the communists overthrow the government. There have been made lots of big mistakes from all European governments after WW1, this caused WW2. In the last 50 years the USA supported a lots of faszist, dictators and other non-democratic people and nations. But this is off-topic here. The USA perhaps would had support Nazi Germany especially against the communists but I think they would never had joined the Axis. Do not forget in these years black people in the USA did not had the same rights as white people. England was an democrazy for all white people. In the colonies they killed for for beeing born there as black people. They behaved in a very razist manner. Until the war broke out Hitler hoped to get England on his site because of the raszism in England! Luckily Europe is today a much better time and such wars will never happen here. Soon Poland, Germany and France will unit in the European Union with the same currency and with much common European law and a small European army! Unbelievable 60 years ago, Lucky times now Sven

I wish you nice dreams Great where do you get 2 additional air fleets after 3 or 4 rounds? And with 3 air fleets it is not easy to beat 3 air fleets and 2 carriers. I tried it out i my last TCP/IP game. It can work but of course there is a risk. But you can destroy the complete axis fleet. And as long as you do not take France the Allies have all the time of the world. Russia will enter war and if Germany only gets around 130 MPs this is a short fight. Perhaps we should try it out if it works like we think. I am not sure but I think if you do not have France or the Scandinavian countries until the end of 1940 I think Germany is in trouble. What about trying it out in a TCP/IP or PBEM game? Sven

Panzer General had such a rule. And it worked fine. When the unit were heavily damaged they often retreated to a free hex. There have been some exceptions which I do not really remember. I think if the units had not fuel left It doesn't retreat. Sven

Welcome to the SC community! You can't build fortifications. The Maginot line is there at the beginning of the game. That is the lesson which I had to learn too. DO NOT ATTACK UNITS AT THE MAGINOT LINE. In history the German Wehrmacht invaded the Lowlands to avoid attacking the Maginot line. I would advise you to copy this strategy. Attack Lowlands and than France. Often the French units at the Maginot line will move to Paris when you attack Paris. When you move your German unit to the fortification it will be destroyed and France does not longer gets MPPs for having this line. I think it would be better to go through Italy or perhaps Switzerland (but this will cause the USA to entry the war earlier) with your armies rather than trying to destroy the units at the Maginot line. I hope this helps Some basic questions are answered in this forum erlier. With the search option you can often find answers to your questions. Sven

I wonder why the most Allied player do not attack the German fleet early. I know exactly where the subs and the small fleet is and I have enough English and French ships. So my first move is to destroy the German fleet than the Italian fleet after they enter the war. Than you can make a sea blockade this make it impossible to invade Norway and Sweden. And with some offshore bombing this can really hurt the Axis. This makes it also possible to move all Canadian units to France and to move the Malta air fleet to France too. Which gives you much more power to destroy the German Blitzkkrieg esecially with the help of the 2 English carriers. As the Allies I would never give France up. Sven

You can defend France. I wrote about a possible strategy which was tested in my first game as Allies against Comrade Trapp in this threat: http://www.battlefront.com/cgi-bin/bbs/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=18;t=001865 It is full of mistakes because I am still a newbie and I had much luck. Sven

Please allow me to contribute some sentences to this forum. I just playes a very nice game against Comrade Trapp. He was Axis and I Allies and we started in 1939 with standard settings. The outcome is that he gave up at the end of 1940 without taking Lowlands or France. After Poland he took no other country. This was my first game as Allies I played never again a game as Allies against a human opponent or the Ai. But my strategy was easy. Just use what I have to defend France AND the Lowlands against the German agression First I sunk his subs in the north Atlantic. Than I moved my ships to the North Sea to sunk the three German ships there. At the same time I sunk 4 of the 5 Italian ships in the Mediterranean Sea and the last ship was damaged. So I was the king of the water. At the beginning of the war I moved all my units to France except one Chorps in London. Two units were efending Marseille and with a little bit and the better supply they took Milan. One of my Polish armies took Praque before Poland fall. So it took 4 or 5 rounds until Poland fell. So I had some time to buy a French and an English HQ and to move it to France to cover the units. The attack on the Lowlands came late and I could defend the Lowlands. My two English air fleets, the france air flets and one carrier with HQ backup caused a lots of losses to the German air fleets. The armies at the maginaot line and two French armies caused also some losses at the Germans. So after loosing three ground units, the entire German flets, most of the Italian ships, a Italian city, one Italian unit at the end of 1940 the Axis gave up and France was not fallen. There have been not much options left for the Germans because English ships covered the Scandinavian staates, England and the Mediterranean Sea. Offhore bombing caused also some losses at German troops. I know I have had much luck to win against an experienced player like Comrade Trapp but the strategy could work if you avoid my mistakes. And the Germans cannot use their secret saenger-bredt antipodal bomber to destroy New York: Sven

zappweden I am a great admirer of your knowledge but I would like to disagree in some points. Yes Truekey is in allied because I declared war 2 rounds before. But Turkey lost 2 units and will soon be inaxis hands without much reinforcements. I captured Romania and Bulgaria already and around Hungary I have 5 units so it will be soon in axis hands too. Yes I hope we can continue this game later. I learned a lot playing against you. Oh Russia lost cities already. Yes I have a lots of chorps, one in each city of my empire and some at the front. And some are very experienced because I had nearly no losses. There aren't so much units left in Turkey. And against a experienced army with some air support they will not resist loinger than 3 or 4 rounds. My units in Turkey and the HQ are all very experiended with 3 or 4 stars. That makes the differences I think. But I do not have enough games experience to be sure. Yes you are a little bit more advanced. But I could concentrate my advances on Germany. Possible but If I can destroy all your English air fleets that would hurt the Allies very bad. I made some mistakes at the beginning this can cost me the victory. Please do not forget this is my second game against an human and I was as tired as you in the night. The discussion is very interesting for me. And I still have my secret weapons like this German secret bomber: or this secret planed A9/A10 which should include the A4/V2 as second stages with a few thounds kilometer reach:

Thank you very much Rambo for you hints regarding the strategy. It is great to learn from the good players. I am still a newbie after 2 (unfinished) TCP/IP games. Last night I played against zappsweden (very interesting game and I had lots of fun, hopefully we can continue this game). He followed your strategy as the allies to avoid much damage in the beginning. Now we are in 1941 and all countries are in war, except the axis minors did not wanted to join axis :mad: He saved all his units for an invasion of France which just occured. The 7 or 8 land units are backed up by the fleet with 9 vessels (I think) and 3 air fleets. France is defended by 8 chorps, 1 HQ and 3 air fleets. General Manstein with 5 experienced units ist just arriving to defend France and the Italian fleet is just arriving too. I am sure I can hold France. Perhaps I will loose the fleet but not France. In the eastern front zappsweden has some tanks in reserve. But I just attack Turkey and after Turkey is fallen Russia is really in trouble. Perhaps I will loose the game because I am still a newbie and I made some big mistakes yesterday night. But If 2 similar skilled player would continue this game I am sure Axis would win. Why do I think so? Because Germany became too strong. I get not 560 MPPs and Italy gets 130 MPPs. The Allies not getting nearly 800 but the strongest nation Russia in only getting around 420 (this is my estimation). Germany also had some tech advancements in the last rounds (after a long time without any advancements). I think if you can concentrate more MPPs in one nation the value of each MPP is increasing because you can use them more effectivly. Just remember the MPPS for research. And England and the USA have to wait 2 or 3 turns until they can buy an air fleet. Germany can buy 1 or 2 air flets every round. There are scale advantages if you can concentrate so much MPPs in one country. Rambo what do you think? Only my 2 (Euro)cent. I wished I could invest more time in this game or millitary strategy. After the Panzer General series this is my second war game. Sven [ December 31, 2002, 06:36 AM: Message edited by: Sven1969 ]

I do not think Rambo is cheating but I never played against him Yesterday in my first game against an human I saw such a strange behavoir of a few of my units. Russia declared war to early and I bought five chorps to defend my eastern front. With the one chorps already there I had only six chorps there. No HQ, no air fleets no other armies or tanks. Russia attacked especially the chorps on my southern end of the line. At the end one chorps was attacked by five air fleets and three ground units. And after weeks of attacking the chorps not even one of my chorps were lost when General Manstein with his armies arrived there. The 6 complete inexperienced chorps defended Germany against 13 ground units and 5 air fleets. In some games against the AI I also saw some invincible units. I think the random factor is sometimes too great. Sven :eek: [ December 30, 2002, 09:59 AM: Message edited by: Sven1969 ]

What about an TCP/IP match? Here where I live we have only 3 work days between dec. 24th and january 1st. So everyone takes these three days off to play SC.

Rambo as the dark side of Hubert?

I had also fun perhaps you like another game tomorrow evening (European time)? Was my first game against a human too. If I had have more units to invade England I would have used them But it is hard to defend when Russia attacks. You saw my units were well defending but above their limits. The fall of Sweden was really in the last second. You one Chorps in Norvege had taken some time, a little bit too much. I was really wondering that the English/French navy could be beaten through the Italien/German ships. In games against the AI I never could beat the navy. But attacking England is much easier against the AI I think for the next game against an human I have to prepare better: red French wine, strong German coffee and some American ice cream :cool:

I found out that it worked after I opened port 6530 and 3460 fpr TCP. That are the ports requested by SC.

I just played my first TCP/IP game against an unknown opponent :cool: At the end of 1941 windows crashed But I had fun. As the axis I took Poland, Denmark, Lowlands, France. The an Army under General Bock attacked Norvege which had a little help from England than Sweden. Right after Russia declared war They took Stockholm. I whished they had took Sweden a few weeks faster because the red army hit my defense line hard. Finland joined war but this did not helped very much in the east. I tried to invade England with General Mansteins. Before I nearly destroyed in a hart fight the British navy, only one damaged carrier escaped. The English air units were also destroyed only one French Air Fleet survived. But my counterpart used the normal trick and whereever I want to enter the coast he had an Chorps in this hex field. So I had no chance. When I moved my ship to another point at th coast he moved one or more Chorps to the coast nearby the ship. I think this schould be changed in a possible SC2 or a possible 1.7 patch. The game balance is totally destroyed in Multiplayer games. My plan was to cause enough trouble with Generals Mansteins Army to move 2 or 3 air fleets to the eastern front. In the same time an Italian Army under an Italian Gerneral destroyed the Spanish units. I just took Madrid before Windows crashed. After taking Spain they should take Portugal and than Turkey and move to the Causasian area in Russia. At the same time 3 German units and 2 Italian units fighted in Yugoslavia. The 3 eastern European countries did not joined Axis until the end of the game. The USA also did not enter the war. I am not sure if I would have won the game. I do not worry about the USA entering the war because I had 5 subs. Yugoslavia and Portugal were also fallen for sure. But England unfallen and the eastern front. That causes me some headache. Sven :confused:

On which port SC listens in TCP/UP games? I sit behind a firewall and a NAT router but the administrator will change the settings for me. Therefore I need to know on which ports SC listens. Thanks

It is important to be fast in the Lowlands and France. After Poland I concentrate on defeating Lowlands and France. Then I move my best army (in my definition the Manstein HQ and 4 armies and a tank unit). Move them from nothern France perhaps with a cheap Chorps at the side which is perhaps destroyed by the British navy. When you start transporting them you should have your (weak) fleet around them and 4 or 5 air fleets at the most northern points of France. At the same time a Italian army with 4 units (later 5) and a HQ attacks Spain, then Portugal and then Gibraltar. After capturing Gibraltar I move the Italian fleet (which fighted only a little to gain experience) to England. Normally at the same time I can capture London. With 2 or three German subs I sunk the British fleet. Then England gets no more troops from the USA and you can move 4 air fleets and 1 HQ (Rommel) to England. After some rounds Enlgand ist yours. Normally Russia attacks before England is mine but my German troops which are not needed in England are moved to Norway and Sweden. Some Italien and some German units are moved to the Russian border so you can tand there long enough until the very experienced troops from England and Sweden arrive. And it is also easy to capture Turkey after defeating England. This gives you the great oppurtunity to attack Russia in the Caucasian area. And this will boost you MPPs and this is the end of the Russian Empire I never engage in the med area. I think this is a waste of troops and time. You get Egypt for free when you defeat England. And you can capture Iraq easily after defeating Turkey.

Zappsweden I fully agree with you in one point. I the axis defeat France too slow Germany has a problem. But in most of the games you can defeat France fast and the AI concentrates some troops and Navy in Egypt. This gives me the chance to land a tank and 4 armies this the Manstein HQ in England. Supported from 4 air units (later 5) with Rommel HQ England is in trouble. Either if the war in France is slow I think you have to attack England. Germany cannot win the war with England in the back. So I prefer to attack England at everx cost after defeating France. The war in Egypt costs a lots of MPPs and do not solve the English problem. And after occupying London it is a matter of time until you get Manchester and England surrenders.

With patch 1.06 installed research is complete worthless. I spend a lots of MPPs and get one or two advances in three years. So in my last game as axis I spend all my MPPs for armies and I defeated England in winter 1941. The game balance for researching is lost. Perhaps research now is realistic (I would disagree in this point too) but it is worthless. You do not get any advances. :mad:

I fully agree zappsweden. But I am only a parttime player with familiy, a job and other hobbies But I think it is more important to destroy the english fleet in the Atlantic and to capture London before Russia declares war on the allies. As playing the allies I try to invade France right after Russia declares war. I think you should focus your troops on the main goals. That what I also read in the book "On War" from Clausewitz. Is my first book on military strategy I am a complete newbie And I never played against a human player :cool: [ December 12, 2002, 05:20 PM: Message edited by: Sven1969 ]

The war in the Africa/Egypt is complete unimportant. I always play axis and I never engage German troops in north Africa. The Italian fleets wipes out the French ships than they attack one English ship at Gibratar or/and the Spanish city (I always conquer Spain after France). After defeating England Egypt is mine. And I need the troops at the Eastern front so I go directly for England after France. My Italian troops go for Spain and some German troops are in Yugoslavia and/or Norvege and Sweden. They are relacated to the eastern front when Russia declares war. Why should I engage in Africa? It needs a lots of troops and I cannot win as much MPPs as in Norvege and Sweden. Sven :cool:

I am not declaring war against Sweden and the other countrys so early. After Poland I take Denmark and the Lowlands and sometime Yugoslavia. But perhaps I should wait until Yugoslavia joins the allies. I only declare war right in front of attacking a country. The difference between Fall Gelb and my game started in 1939 is only Yugoslavia and that I did not attacked Norway. Perhaps I had bad luck but Rusia always declared war in summer 1940. But in reality Russia was not able to join the war in summer 1940 and why Stalin should join war in 1940 without beeing attacked? I hope we will see a small diplomatic option in SC2 Normally Germany should do everything to get Spain, Italy, Turkey and the eastern European Countries to join the axis as early as possible. And I never saw Spain or Turkey joining the Axis.

I love this game But I really have problems to win as the axis in Fall Weiss. And I never take Norway. And the worst fact is that Russia attackes me in June 1940! That is way too early and I have no chance to survive long even with the MPPs from France. When I start playing Fall Gelb it is much easier. Russia never attacks me before summer 1941. Until then I have France, Vichy, Spain, Protugal, Yugoslavia, Romania, Greek, Hungary and enough some troops in England sometimes I have London and Sweden. So I have enough MPPs and normally a full line of armys defending my country. What is the secret when starting in 1939? I always have problems to take Norway so I concentrate to take Poland fast, then Denmark und the Lowlands. Sometime I attack Yugoslavia. I know it is important to be fast. But there are some French and English units with something different in mind