aka_tom_w

In the 70's I recall playing something like that on a Commadore PET at the liberary in the college where I now work. It was Star Trek and it was addictive, but the interface was REALLY bad, all black and white sort like grpahics using ASCII characters, if you can believe that! But I was just a teenager and I was spellbound by it! -tom w

Interesting comment and observation They are working on the v1.02 patch so maybe a small tweak in the HMG fatigue model and "auto-sneak-to-exhaustion" issue can still be made?? :confused: -tom w

ROTFL OK! that was one of the funniest things I have read on the forum lately! That just could be the Most Humourous Post of the Week! Nice! -tom w

I think we need some form of We-Go forum (I'm not sure how its just a concept) so that Redwolf and Steve don't keep trying to get the last word in here. I'm joking really but one of the very BEST things about the CM system (aside from EFOW which is one of the other BEST things) is the we-go system which means no one goes "first" or gets the "last shot in" in the "last turn". Now can we simulate that in the forum here somehow??? Posted in the very best of humour -tom w

I think we best put this one to rest Peace -tom w

I believe Steve and Charles (in v1.01) have this behaviour (HMG sneaking and getting tired) exactly the way they want it to be. The HMG squads are different and pay a different penalty when forced to sneak or when they panic or break under fire. I would suggest Steve has looked closely at what has been pointed out in this thread as a questionable (?) HMG behaviour and is satisfied that the tests of this behaviour demonstrate what he and Charles intended when they coded the model for the game. I suspect this one will not change and we best not get or HMG got in the open getting shot at while moving. At least we know they looked at it. Honestly I think Steve really tried to give this one a fair shake, he saw what we pointed out and pretty much said... "Yeah, thats the way we intended it to work" You can't ask for much more than that. I can live with it the way it is now. -tom w [ November 25, 2002, 03:06 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

" But, while it does not take 15 turns to recover from exhaustion, in effect the unit was 15 turns not "ready" after one single turn of incoming firepower 17 with no casualties. This is by far not in line with what other CMBB units do in the same situation." But maybe German HMG units are special in that regard because what they are carrying is so heavy? Just a thought in any case, these HMG units seem to have a Special and unique morale and "getting tired" model all to them selves. It would seem that Steve and Charles intend it to be that way, (at least from Steve's posts it one might conclude that ) -tom w [ November 25, 2002, 01:00 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

bump just for the curious -tom w

bump

Thanks Steve Yes I think that is the whole issue right there. Once the HMG chooses to sneak it does so until it becomes exhausted. BUT it seems now that one "work around" is to order the unit to Hide, so long as the unit is not paniced and you can issue an order. the bug seems to be the once the HMG is "flustered" you cannot overide its Sneak order and it will choose to Sneak until it is exhausted. -tom w [ November 24, 2002, 08:21 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

I sent SuperSulo's files to Steve. I saved one (#5) in particular where the behaviour was easy to replicate. -tom w [ November 24, 2002, 04:52 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

just for the record I LOVE the new infantry model. I really like the fact that control is taken from the player when units get caught in the open under fire, IF they panic. When the player loses control of their unit(s) because they break route or panic it should be considered the "appropriate" punishment of bad tactics or a predictable outcome of bad luck or a bad tactical situation. Panic is the least punitive because units can recover from panic fairly quickly. Units that become broken represent a more punitive result that can leave the player without control for a long time sometimes even until the end of the game. I like that part and I think the morale model works well in this game. BUT what Redwolf is trying to point out is, what appears to him, as an obvious bug in the morale model for HMG's underfire in the open and I think he may have a good point here. -tom w

Gaylord The trigger is not the problem here. The issue is that the HMG team reverts to the sneak command, AFTER the firing has stopped and AFTER the player has issued a move order. What happens is that you cannot prevent the sneak-to-exhaustion behaviour after they have come under fire. (the only known work around at this point is to give a hide order that should prevent sneak to exhaustion, BUT that only works if they did not freak out and go into panic mode) -tom w [ November 24, 2002, 03:51 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

I miss him too anyone know anything about his absence from the forum of late? :confused: -tom w [ November 24, 2002, 03:45 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

Yes, I'm gonna keep on moving because I'm a soldier! MG fire 20-30 meters away isn't anywhere near me! It wouldn't be such a problem if the suppression modeling wasn't so unforgiving, but the way things are now your support team hits the ground at the first bullets heard in the area and then goes into auto-sneak mode the rest of the game.</font>

that is an interesting test thanks for posting the pics and the test results, Redwolf I hope Steve and Charles and Matt are looking at this issue. It would appear it does indeed deserve some attention and maybe a coding tweak in v1.02 (maybe?) -tom w

I'm just wondering if this has been discussed elsewhere (other threads) or is this new? Does it happen in v1.01 curious :confused: -tom w [ November 24, 2002, 11:39 AM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

thats a good question?? my guess would be that the AI is not coded/programed/smart enough to use MTC. but I could be wrong :confused: -tom w

I have not lost interest in this one just busy with Real Life lately -tom w

MadMatt adds this: "1.02 will undoubtably include some more models and textures and will, just like 1.01, make the game even better and feature filled. Madmatt" -tom w

MadMatt adds this: "1.02 will undoubtably include some more models and textures and will, just like 1.01, make the game even better and feature filled. Madmatt" -tom w

THANKS! that is the BEST suggestion I have heard yet. I have tried the hide order a few times when my units were tired and bordering on breaking and panicing and hide does seem to keep them idle, resting, stationary and with their heads down so they can maybe avoid panicing and routing and recover some of their composure and rest a bit. -tom w

Steve Said: "2. Sneak - CMBB's infantry is too likely to use the SNEAK function when coming under fire. Instead of shrugging off the enemy fire or doing something else "intelligent", the unit reverts to Sneak and attempts to get to cover too often. Cover either already ordered to or new cover that the TacAI designates. Sometimes this cover is not in the "right" direction or propper for the current situation." It would seem Redwolf and a few others have pointed out expamples wher Heavy weapons crews that are no longer under fire automatically revert to sneak (no matter what order the player gives them) and then auto exhaust them selfs in no time. Has anyone got a save game file of this they can send to Steve or Matt where this behaviour can be replicated and studied? looks like this issue is a candidate for tweak in v1.02 for sure (we can only hope). I am confident if it is a REAL bug and they can study it and replicate it, that Steve and Charles will try to address/correct it in v1.02. Thanks -tom w

Um... since I don't (edit oops ) know you personally... And I can't really be sure from your post.... Can I ask if that was a sarcastic post? -tom w [ November 22, 2002, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

Um... since I don't (edit oops ) know you personally... And I can't really be sure from your post.... Can I ask if that was a sarcastic post? -tom w [ November 22, 2002, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]