More realistic combat

[m3tan]

I just started playing SC and think it's a great game overall but I feel the combat system needs some tweaking to yield more realistic results. I've decided to dive head first into designing a campaign but wanted to lay the groundwork for my modified combat system first. I'm still a newbie and I probably haven't picked up on all the nuances yet so I wanted to post my intial observations and get some feedback. Is there some central receptacle or thread I should look for a discussion on enhancing realism? it would be greatly appreciated if more experienced players or guys who have designed major mods could chime in. Thanks.

My observations:

1) The unit density is too high and there isn't enough room for maneuver. In many instances, the most important "skill" is how to cycle units in and out to concentrate firepower in one "schwerpunkt". One misclick and you have a logjam. I prefer a more fluid front with less unit density and more opportunity for manuever. The simple fix seems to increase the number of tiles and add ZOC (+1 cost to fire and/or move when adjacent to enemy).

2) U-boats are FAR too powerful against other naval units. There were some instances early in the war of u-boats sinking capital ships but those isolated events have been sensationalized. The u-boat was primarily an instrument of strategic warfare. In SC, it seems much more efficient to hunt capital ships that sit on convoy routes. Also u-boats are killed far too easily when spotted by destoyers or carriers. Hunting for u-boats (and surface raiders) was a maddening experience for the Allies until 1943. Instead of making the map all sea areas, I think the trick is to reduce the firepower of both sides (u-boats and destroyers/carriers) until ASW / Adv subs are developed.

3) The constant shore bombardment of land units on coastal tiles is silly. A battleship could NEVER kill an army. At most it should reduce entrenchment and demoralize slightly. Is there a way to eliminate all damage to land units? I see that battleships and cruisers have a SA of 1 but destroyers 0. I swear I've seen AI Soviet destroyers pounding away at German land strength in the Black Sea...

4) Tanks seems way too cheap. 2 strikes at 4/5 versus 1 strike at 3/3 for an army. Also both stats get boosted with 1 tech instead of 2 with infantry. Yet armor cost 250 and an army 175? Why would one EVER buy an army?

5) The relationship between supply/experience/reinforcements doesn't seem quite balanced. Experience never seems to drop because I have so few veteran units even after years of fighting. Both sides are constantly rebuilding units back to 10. Combat is essentially an all or nothing affair - eliminate the unit entirely or watch a 1 pop right back to 10 next turn. It would seem that if experience was gained more rapidly and there were stiffer reinforcement limits, that there would be a more interesting decision point. And concentrating firepower to eliminate a unit in a single round wouldn't be so pivotal. I've been trying to think of a way of manipulating HQs/supply to do this but it doesn't seem to be allowed by the editor. Is there any way to limit reinforcements?

[Nupremal]

1 and 2 can be changed by modding - I did that in my version. Similar is possible with 3 and more room, as I also did.

Tanks are good no doubt but you still need infantry and you have only so many you can build. I lowered the cost of armies also and adjusted some of the stats. Again, the mod can change that.

The last I dont agree with, it seems very balanced to me. Again, can be edited. Try my mod but its mostly for human vs human play.

[Big Al]

I 2nd Nup's statement

[m3tan]

With #5, perhaps the thing I'm missing is one should bomb the city/town to reduce it's supply value to under 5 for an extended siege? It just seems that there are too many opportunities to rebuild a unit back to 10. Maybe that's because I haven't focused on cutting supply but just bashing the unit. Again, I'm still figuring out some stuff. But generally you'd both agree with my observations for #1-4?

[crispy131313]

I think the biggest issue with the current default campaign is turn length. The summer campaigns are too short. A few rain storms and the campaign is a waste.

[Big Al]

With SC2 you can change ANYTHING and make it closer to realism if you want.

If you think subs are too tough vs surfase ships then reduce their naval attack/defense.

You can use specific scripts for supply and here is an example.

In my mod there are pacific islands like Midway. Placed a ship marker near a port. If an enemy ship sits in that marker box it reduces supply each turn on the port untill its zero to make the unit out of supply. To get it in supply the opposing fleet must control that sea hex. I scripted that and borrowed it from the original SC2 scenario.

There is soooo much you can do in SC2 using the scripts. Nup came up with things Hubert and I didnt, I came up with things Nup and Hubert didnt. Hubert came up with things that Nup and I didnt. So there is tons of flexibility.

Somethings have to be abstract and very creative but it is do-able.

There are lots of ideas I came up with that didnt fit in my mod like coastal guns and mine fields for example.

So look at the formulas and see if you can adjust them accordingly.

[Nupremal]

I dont actually disagree with 1-4 for the standard game. I actually do agree, but that is why you cann mod it.