Convoy Idea

[david12345]

Was thinking that convoys could be randomly generated and a specific strength, and move like ships. The owning country could escort them if they deem necessary. The convoys would move along the convoy routes, controlled automatically by the computer. The enemy could attack them physically with units.

The "money" that each convoy carries would be it's strength, and attacks could slowly reduce the strength until it is destroyed.

If more control by the player is wanted, they could even be "created" units. For example, the USA would like to send 50 to England, just build a 50 convoy for the cost of 50, and it would appear the next turn.

I think this would be way better than the current model...

Not sure if the SC engine would support this, however.

[Gronq]

Quite like the 'unit' idea. Each unit could be max 10 MPPs which you could then escort across the atlantic as you would see fit.

Building on that idea and, hopefully, thinking, out of the box a bit. Maybe it's worth exploring 'splitting' sea tiles (not any of the land tiles) into 4 thereby simulating the vastness of the ocean. You could then also introduce a research area to do with radar as well. Hmm, could see this one being quite interesting...

[xwormwood]

I wouldn't be thrilled to move supply or convoy ships on my own.

This would be WORK, not fun anymore.

At least in my eyes.

[Gronq]

I think that could be sorted by giving the user options. For example:

- Play with the system as is.

- Play with the computer moving convoy units and escorts along user determined routes.

- Play with the computer moving convoy units and escorts along routes determined entirely by the computer.

- Play with units completely controlled by the user.

Personally, I can see lots of opportunities here to improve the naval side of the game. Almost making it a separate game in itself...

[xwormwood]

... For example: ...

making it a separate game in itself...

Thats what i would suggest if anybody would ask me about this specific feature.

[John DiFool the 2nd]

I've thought about this before, but Hubert has always come down on the side of playability, and I'm not sure it would work without stacking ships into convoys/task forces (as otherwise you might need at least 2 escorts per convoy to allow for a reasonable chance to protect it from attacks from any direction). With a sufficient sized map it might work, where it would take c. 5-6 turns for the convoy to cross the ocean-otherwise the window of opportunity for the u-boats to intercept it would be very slim.

Hmm...is it possible to script things so that a "convoy" unit can be built in one country (replacing say AA or Special Forces) and shipped to another country (as a transport), unloaded, and a MPP bonus applied to the recipient upon disembarking?

[SeaMonkey]

We've discussed this in depth before and although there are some good ideas it needs to be approached with a great deal of scrutiny as it very easily leads into micromanagement.

Basically I would start with a completely automated system, as we have now and only add a touch of player control initially, try it out and then make additional features. Something like X,Y tile to W,Z tile, sending, pull down menu, "MPPs(# of turns), supply(level of supply that costs MPPs / turn), designated unit(amphib or transport), etc., attach escorts, organize taskforce"

If the final tile is a sea tile then the designated unit drops off when it gets there to amphib mode and the player takes control from there. In this manner we could diminish the players interaction with the actual moving of the assets and if everything goes smoothly they arrive at the destination. If intercepted then we see an option for players to accept the AI calculated results or play it out on a battlescreen, perhaps in two distinct levels of engagement. First level would be surface action assets like Cas, DDs, BBs, and subs and the secondary deployment level would include our carriers, their air assets along with the transport contingent. Surface assets would have to penetrate the first level to get to the secondary level of assets but carrier airgroups and stealthy subs perhaps could make the secondary level without fully being exposed to the first combat level.

Admittedly a rough draft.

[david12345]

thanx for the input, but you guys making this sound much harder than I was thinking.

The computer could randomly generate convoys and move them, if they get to the destination port, the computer would automatically apply the mpps.

There is no micromanagement at all. All you have to do is cover them with dd's. Of course there can be losses to subs that could lower the strength of the convoy.

example:

convoy generates in usa port. moves a speed of 4-5 tiles a turn to either murmask or an english port. Let's say the convoy is 50mpps in strength.

A u-boat attacks. Let's say it takes off 10 strength. The convoy continues and lands as a strength of 40. Upon arriving at the port, it's remaining strength (40) is automatically added to the receiving nation.

[SeaMonkey]

Isn't this what we kind of have presently? As I see it, you want to be able to arrange a convoy, varying in MPP transport level, set by the AI and either protect it or attack it as it moves to its destination, correct?

Are you assigning DD/CVL escorts or are the players moving the current SC units along with the convoy? So instead of the subs knowing where the convoy routes are and sitting on them they actually have to search for them and the player physically attack the convoy icon with his sub/surface unit?

The AI sets the path of the convoy and it can be variable by the subroutine? Do the escorts, if not assigned, know the path or just hopefully fan out in front(pro-active ramming) or move behind awaiting a sub attack to initiate their counter?

[david12345]

I just think a physical convoy beats the abstract model. The computer would move the allied convoy after the axis turn, so the allies could see where it went, and send units to cover it. The axis would have to attack the "icon" to kill mpps.

The allied covering units would not be assigned, but rather existing units that are moved. The allied player could also choose not to escort, and which (when more than one) to escort if units are low.

The AI moves the convoy more or less along the historical routes. Convoys could blunder into ambushing subs (something that happened). The escorts would not have to guess the path because the convoy would move at the end of the axis turn, so it would be in place for the allied turn.

I don't think this is too much micro-management at all.

[Nupremal]

don't think that adds much - seems fine the way it is

[Bluestew]

I just think a physical convoy beats the abstract model. The computer would move the allied convoy after the axis turn, so the allies could see where it went, and send units to cover it. The axis would have to attack the "icon" to kill mpps.

My issue with the convoy system is that it is partially abstracted and partially physical. No physical convoys yet the units attacking the invisible convoys are actually on the map. There is no way to protect the invisible convoys but to cover the huge convoy lanes with battle assets. It should be all or nothing in either direction. I would accept either design decision as long as it was uniform.