Target arc falling short?

[Sivodsi]

Hi guys,

In the new model it is not possible to set a target arc off the edge of the map, which means that if the enemy is in the corner of a map it is impossible to include the potential target in the dead centre of the arc. I know how it works in CMX1, but because of this inability in CMX2 to set arcs properly does it change the behaviour?

So if your target arc falls short of the enemy, and the enemy comes into view, will your weapons fire?

Does it depend on the arc'ed unit? For example, if your T55 has an arc that falls short of another enemy T55, would it refuse to fire? Or woud the AI step in and fire a shot? Or would it only fire a shot after being fired on?

Does infantry behave the same or differently?

[Pandur]

target arcs are verry "whisy-washy" if you understand what i mean.

my guys regulary ignore the cover arc and shoot things outside of it.

whatever, steve said that the cover arc over map edge is on the "list",...somewhere on the list...

said that, currently forgett the "segment" arc and go for the 360° arc. its not optimal but the other version is verry limited so mostly not usable(map edge, corners, etc...).

i kept milling about that for that long so steve saw it once and asured me they did not forgott it and it should be changed sometimes.

[Sivodsi]

Thanks for that,Pandur.

I really don't see the point of the 360° arc, though. Shouldn't they just naturally keep an all round lookout? What difference does having such an arc make, apart from making the terrain suddenly go an annoying highlighter yellow (bring back the old covered arc!!!!).

The point with covered arcs is to get them 'looking' in the right direction, where the known threat is, so that the turrets don't just go to their default position. With 360° arcs the turrets will just be in the default position so won't make a difference, I would have thought.

Cheers

[Pandur]

I really don't see the point of the 360° arc, though.

me too, sometimes it has its uses but these are much, much more limited than the good old 180° arc we had in CMx1.

The point with covered arcs is to get them 'looking' in the right direction, where the known threat is, so that the turrets don't just go to their default position. With 360° arcs the turrets will just be in the default position so won't make a difference, I would have thought.

verry right, and i also kept explaining it that way. especially in the case of vehicles like you said, it make absolutely no difference since the turret always faces the 12. no matter if cover arc or not.

so when the arc cannot define the facing of the turret like the 180° arc could do, it lost 90% of its use. means its useless for the most.

the most tragic thing i find with the new UI is the unflexibility(sp!?) when useing more than one command in the same tab.

its a good thing that "Face" cancels area fire for the most part but its more than horrible that "face" cancels a cover arc too...i mean that quiet annoying.

you can define the turret facing independently from the hull, with the non perfect segment arc, but you can not define the facing of the hull while haveing a cover arc issued in case the TACai does face a lousy RPG team again when a tank could wait down the street.

thats a real downside, as it leads to pretty stupid situations.

[JonS]

There is a work around for this.

When you double tap on a unit it will highlight all the units in that pn/coy/bn (depending on just which unit you tap). You can then set the covered arc for the first unit you clicked on, and all the other units will clone that arc. Et voila, covered arcs which extend off the map.

Not brilliant, granted, but it's better than nowt.

[birdstrike]

Wow, Jon, this is a great tip. Have to try that out. Thanks

[slug88]

Circular arcs are I find extremely useful for room clearing and house-to-house fighting when combined with the hunt command. They provide for a way to hunt between rooms without being distracted by targets outside the building, while maintaining coverage in all directions.

[Sivodsi]

Yes, JonS nice work around! Does it work for all units selected, or only if there is a line of command?

I'll have to give it a go.

[JonS]

Originally posted by Sivodsi:

Does it work for all units selected, or only if there is a line of command?

I don't know - I've only done it where chain of command was in effect, but I expect that if you use the "select another" or rubber-band selection it should also work. That would make life a lot easier, actually, since you'll be more likely to find a unit which can draw the kind of covered arc you want that way.

[Pandur]

my problem with that is that if i need a unit to have a specific cover arc, i dont need another unit to have it?! or how should it work, i dont get that workaround...

[JonS]

1) Select the unit you want to give a CA.

2) Select another unit that will be able to give the shape of CA you want.

3) Give both units the shape CA you want the first unit to have.

4) Deselect both units.

5) select the second unit

6) cancel it's CA

(You may need to do steps 1 and 2 in reverse order. You can probably optimise the above sequence)

[Sivodsi]

Still no answers to the question I posted above:

So if your target arc falls short of the enemy, and the enemy comes into view, will your weapons fire?

[Chainsaw]

Still no answers to the question I posted above:

I had my troops firing BEYOND its fire arc so yes they can.

But IF and WHY they do that is beyond me as well.

[TheVulture]

Still no answers to the question I posted above:

In the demo scenario, back around 1.04 or so, I had an M1 covering the corner where the Syrian BMPs appear. One appeared just outside the cover arc of the M1, and they both sat there for the whole turn ignoring each other. I dare say it would have responded if fired upon though.

Whether that was something that has been tweaked since then I don't know, but it seems to be a cse of sometimes they will stick to their arc, sometimes they will fire at things outside the arc that haven't shot at them, and the difference seems to be lurking deep in the murky depths of the game engine and appears rather impenetrable to the players.

[Sivodsi]

Thanks for the answers, guys. Hopefully some of this behaviour will be tweaked in the forthcoming patch and the AI will do things in a sane way.