Bruce70 Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 AIUI, each soldier has specific skills, experience, etc. So if you have a squad member manning a captured gun, with no prior experience with such a weapon, how will that effect things like reload times, accuracy etc? Assuming that these things are drastically effected, I see no reason to think that capturing enemy guns etc is unrealistic. Instead, 9 times out of 10 it will not be worthwhile using captured equipment, but the other one time when there is an approaching tiget and an abandoned 88 sitting nearby who wouldn't try and turn the gun on the approaching tank? So what are the possible ways in which performance may be degraded for captured equipment, in what circumstances will that degradation be evident, and will this be enough for players to quickly realise that using captured equipment is rarely worthwhile? P.S. Looking forward to the game, hope this is the beginning of a long and significant series, that continues to improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megakill Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Success of using enemy equipment greatly depends on skills of the specific soldier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCW Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Since the numbers are small in TOW, would'nt a machine gun take care of all your infantry fairly quickly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuirassier Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 If you human wave, then yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Bruce70, so far all I can say is rather anectodal from my own play sessions, but it does appear that re-crewing enemy weapons is definitely not a requirement, and sometimes downright stupid. In the AAR up on SimHQ I did it a few times mainly to highlight that it's possible, but in all three occasions it cost me dearly and lost a lot of infantry doing it without much to show for. One of the captured guns managed to take out an (immobilized) enemy tank, but the other times I lost way more than I gained. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M Hofbauer Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Originally posted by Megakill: Success of using enemy equipment greatly depends on skills of the specific soldier. Oh, that prompts an important question: how detailed will the soldier info be, namely, how detailed will the after-action revioew of forces be? will it be like CC where you could look at each soldiers attributes and any change therein? the AAR screenshots I saw so far were rather..general and lacking a bit in detail. or did I miss some rspective screenshot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce70 Posted August 9, 2006 Author Share Posted August 9, 2006 Good, then I see no reason for any more desent regarding captured equipment. If done properly it can only add to the game. Should the time have been spent on other things? Maybe, but it's done now so there is nothing to be gained from further discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 M Hofbauer, after each battle you not only get to review your forces in detail, you will actually have to assign experience points to them, to raise each individuals skill ratings (or you can let the computer do it via the auto-assign button). Soldiers are rated for a dozen or so attributes/skills including accuracy, scouting etc. At the very end of my AAR on SimHQ you can see I think a screen showing the debrief where you assign skill points, rank promotions and medals. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComradeP Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Success of using enemy equipment greatly depends on skills of the specific soldier. ...but I only saw one "firing" (or the like) upgrade for the RPG portion. In short: every soldier is a superhuman again who is just as proficient with a rifle as with an 88? Please tell me I'm wrong, pretty please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megakill Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Originally posted by ComradeP: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Success of using enemy equipment greatly depends on skills of the specific soldier. ...but I only saw one "firing" (or the like) upgrade for the RPG portion. In short: every soldier is a superhuman again who is just as proficient with a rifle as with an 88? Please tell me I'm wrong, pretty please. </font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComradeP Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 You will see that infantry guys have minimal "gunnery" skill. Tank gunner would be more or less ok to use a field gun for example though. Infantry guys will miss almost all the time Which leads to the obvious counter question: if infantry and tank gunners are not the ones operating field guns, who are operating them (and why isn't infantry operating them, especially AT guns were operated by infantry after all) and can you "buy" or "recruit" them prior to a mission, so the guns you encounter can be put to some good use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollingt Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Try and remember that he is thinking in Russian and translating to English. IOWs, replace infantry with rifleman and it makes sense. Don't take everything so literally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarquelne Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Originally posted by rollingt: Try and remember that he is thinking in Russian and translating to English. IOWs, replace infantry with rifleman and it makes sense. Don't take everything so literally. I've been running all his posts through Google's English-to-French auto-translator, and then back. It seems to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megakill Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Originally posted by Tarquelne: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by rollingt: Try and remember that he is thinking in Russian and translating to English. IOWs, replace infantry with rifleman and it makes sense. Don't take everything so literally. I've been running all his posts through Google's English-to-French auto-translator, and then back. It seems to help. </font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComradeP Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Try and remember that he is thinking in Russian and translating to English. IOWs, replace infantry with rifleman and it makes sense. Don't take everything so literally. Well, some games have specialised artillerists, I was just wondering whether this game had them too. Thanks for the reply anyway, Megakill! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M Hofbauer Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Originally posted by Moon: M Hofbauer, after each battle you not only get to review your forces in detail, you will actually have to assign experience points to them, to raise each individuals skill ratings (or you can let the computer do it via the auto-assign button). Soldiers are rated for a dozen or so attributes/skills including accuracy, scouting etc. At the very end of my AAR on SimHQ you can see I think a screen showing the debrief where you assign skill points, rank promotions and medals. Martin Moon, that is excellent news. I think.... Well, I am sure it is... You see, on one hand, this is shaping up real nicely, watching your soldiers evolve, giving out medals, scavenging, capturing (and keeping!) equipment. This is what I as a CC player always dreamed of. We probably both agree that these aspects rate highly in the fun department - but they're actually a bit of a penalty w/r/t realism. So, this game could end up as a wargaming heaven, or a gameyish nightmare. But I am convinced it will be the former. Looking forward to ToW ! oh, and re. the discussion about Megakill: actually you can't praise him ehough for his *excellent* language skills IMO. in fact, from my experience with the english of Oleg & Co. re. IL2 at first I doubted that Megakill could be an official from the developing 1C studios, because their hallmark was a ...uh, "not always easily comprehensible" use of the english language (not that it mattered that muich, what matters is the game they produce, but sometimes it was really hard to understand just what they were getting at), and Megakill using a, well, normal english. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Given the realities of a RTS, do we really want as players to be given the burden of "assigning" experience to soldiers, or wouldn't it be more sensical to just let the game track this automatically? I trust this was a mis-type? How does one "assign experience" to units/individuals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M Hofbauer Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: Given the realities of a RTS, do we really want as players to be given the burden of "assigning" experience to soldiers, or wouldn't it be more sensical to just let the game track this automatically?nobody is forcing you to do it. Like moon said, if you dont intervene manually, you can leave it tothe game to automatically assign it. I trust this was a mis-type? How does one "assign experience" to units/individuals? well I sure hope it wasnt a "mis-type", as you call it. how do you assign experience? well, technically you cant. how can you jump all over the battlefield while the action is paused? how can you rewind and rerun the last minute of firefight again and again? the answer of course is: in reality, you cant. in a game, you can. if you need a mental crutch to get over it, think of it this way: Obergefreiter K. Nadier did something heroic during last battle, say, he disabled a KV with a toothpick. His Spiess H. Lohfraunachbarin commends him and as a reward ("wenn dir des scho so an schpass macht, nachert kannsde des gleich amol richtich lerne") sends him to the Panzernahbekämpfungslehrgang which means a week in the rear (as a reward) and increased experience in taking out KV's with toothpicks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComradeP Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Did you take that from the book "Wunderwaffen 2: Zahnstocher" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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