What do Amphibious Transports and Amphibious Tech do?

[Edwin P.]

What does amphibious transports do and how is this new unit affected by the new Amphibious Tech research area?

[pzgndr]

Amphib transports will make invasions in SC2 a bit different. Idea is to embark units on one turn, then move AND unload on the next turn(s). If units remain at sea, readiness drops. So, invasion ranges will be more or less limited. Trans-Atlantic invasions will be risky, which may be OK for North Africa in 1942 but probably not OK for D-Day in France in 1943. This should be more interesting. :cool:

As for tech, we have some ideas but nothing definite yet. Btw, regular transports will work about the same as in SC1 but will NOT be able to unload except at a friendly port. You'll HAVE to use amphib transports for invasions, and they'll cost more.

[Edwin P.]

In WWII the Allies landed at ports on the Western Coast of Morocco. In light of the new restrictions on Amphibious landings would it make sense to add a port along the Atlantic Coast of French Algeria?

Operation Torch - Allied Invasion of North Africa

[ May 14, 2004, 10:41 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

[Raven25]

Amphibious warfare started out as just regular old boats being embarked from a larger ship to the shore. That's how it's still done today (and was done in WWII), specialized ships carrying amphibious landing craft as well as supplies.

For amphibious warfare I think it should reflect more of the Marines' amphibious landings in the Pacific. Basically, what I'm suggesting is that in SC2 you can buy the ships that held the troopers, but not lose any combat readiness (there were constant drills and PT to maintain cmobat readiness). Basically a ship that you buy, put in a port, and be able to load, say, either a tank group, an army, or two corps.

But there's more. There were heavy preliminary bombardments, as well as aerial bombings. Perhaps an option for the ships where they can attack certain land units from two spaces away to simulate naval bombardment (the hex and close range limitations prevents you from being able to soften up the enemy without blocking your invasion force's landing area).

And there's also more to this idea. Because in rl the Navy didn't want Marine planes on their precious large carriers, the Marines used "Jeep Carriers", basically smaller slower carriers but could carry a squadron of corsairs (the lethal fighter bomber combo). Even though these were not used in the European theater, if we could truly alter history then a special unit such as that for America would be great. Naturally this carrier should be better at air-ground (worse at air-air), and also slower.

Basically have the abililty to simulate the large Pacific fleets that went from island to island, bombarding them and then landing on them.

[Night]

Hmm this is interesting

[ev]

Amph tech could also represent the development of UDT's: under water demolition teams. UDT's are the predecesors of the Navy Seals. Their job was important for scouting beaches, finding adequate landing sites, finding and destroying underwater obstacles, etc.

From a conceptual point of view, UDT's could be "part" to the Amph Unit. However, beter landing equipment and support units (read UDT's), were all part of what allowed for succesful, albeit costly, landings in enemy held territory.

Please note, I am not advocating for the creation of U.D.T.'s The scope of the game is to large to include a team of 8 frogment blasting underwater obstacles on the shores of Italy or France. I am only saying this is part of what makes for a more effective Amph Unit.

[J P Wagner]

Not allowing land units to magically cross the sea to invade will be a huge difference in gameplay and I hope the AI will aggressively purchase and use these transports...in SC1 we saw a rather limited AI invasion capability and questionable purchasing decisions, so this combination could make AI invasions in SC2 even more difficult... However, I'm sure Hubert will have some new tricks up his sleeve for SC2...

[Edwin P.]

Agreed, the Axis AI never launched large Amphibious invasions and the Allied AI only invaded France.

In my opinion the most important amphibious invasions in general play are:

1. Norway/Sweden - simply put, without their production the Axis AI is dead meat.

2. Greece - so the Italians can take Greece in one turn

3. Vichy - so that Vichy falls on one turn

4. Spain

5. Sea Lion

6. Egypt

7. North Africa -so the allies can take those Italian Cities

8. Italy - so that humans have to guard it.

[Raven25]

Frogmen (UDT's) wouldn't be good for SC2. Why? Because in the European theater there wasn't much use of powerful ship obstacles in the mediterranean or the Atlantic. Mines were only temporary barriers, and were usually used to protect a dock if they were needed. Whereas in the Pacific where islands that were assaulted were small, and it was easy and not too expensive to lay a thousand mines around an island. However, the Germans knew that they had better things to use their valuable metal on. Instead of laying lots of mines, they could build a U-Boat. Much much more effective than a whole mine field. And in some senses cheaper.

[Edwin P.]

pzgndr :

The new amphibious research tech will do something to enhance capabilities (cost reductions, reduced supply losses, etc.), but this is still being worked out.

[Retributar]

I watched the history channel not too long ago about D-Day. They said that the Germans had a lot of floating mines...that were anchored to chains i think...and that they were 'timed' to be active for only so long. After that they would deactivate and sink to the Ocean floor.

According to the show...the allies invaded France just a few days after all the German sea mines had sunk to the bottom. Had the Allies had to confront all of those mines...the invasion may have had a different outcome.

Whether the Allies knew about the function of these mines or their time-table for activation or deactivation i don't know!.