Idea: Alternative History Campaign Generator

[Edwin P.]

As mentioned in another thread (Farewell) by Desert Dave the game Totaler Krieg offers a random pre-war (1914-1938) events generator.

It would be most interesting if Sc2 included this as an option.

You would select 1939 Alternative History Campaign and the system would randomly select the events that may or may not change the game, in addition to compiling a 1914-1938 History report; with boiler plate paragraphs, that would be accessed from the reports menu.

Example 01:

The system selects Communist Spain as an alternative history event. Spain begins the game as a Soviet minor nation ally. An Axis attack on Spain increases Russian war readiness and an Axis attack on Russia increases Spanish war readiness.

The History Report would replace the standard paragraph on Spain with:

"The defeat of the facist forces during the Spanish Civil War of 1936-1939 lead to the ascendency of the Communist party in Spain and the formal signing of an Economic Cooperation and Mutual Defense treaty with the Soviet Union."

[ December 31, 2005, 10:32 AM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

[Desert Dave]

X-tremely reflective Edwin P:

It would be most interesting if Sc2 included this as an option.

Bill and I have both campaigned for "special events" since the beginning, given our appreciation of 3R, A3R and JP's 3R and how they handled these.

Now, since Hubert is fiercely focused on getting AI done, it's not very likely we'll see very much of this, at least, in initial edition.

Later? Who knows. :cool:

In any event YOU can use "Activation #3" scripts to MOD a game and include the above mentioned "Spanish Civil War Variant,"

OR... let's say, "Austria's Defiance," or "Czech Independence" or "Venezuela Oil Convoys," or early preparedness and entry by Belgium (... actively aligned with France),

OR... "Z-plan" - using "unit scripts."

And etc.

What you'll need to do is create a new '39 scenario and move the starting date up a bit so to allow these "what ifs" to be established, based on the requisite conditions of existance.

Then, you can use that most amazing! Editor and have SEPARATE Nations like Austria, Venezuela and even, should you choose, a Free French colony somewhere on the board.

Like others have already mentioned, I look forward with GREAT anticipation to see just what snazzy razz-matazz you'll come up with Edwin.

[ December 31, 2005, 09:01 AM: Message edited by: Desert Dave ]

[Edwin P.]

I will try not to disappoint you and the others who are looking forward to see what campaigns I can develop.

In the meantime, its good to hear that Hubert is hard at work on the AI.

Any news on the AI? Will it will access a wider range of strategic, operational, and tactical strategies in Sc2? Will it be less predictable?

[ December 31, 2005, 11:36 AM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

[SeaMonkey]

Most excellent, this game is truly an inspiration for the future.

I'm elated with the 60% cadre buy back feature, a stupendous addition...well worth the wait.

Now for everyone...not being pessimistic, but my experience with the AI idiosycracies, especially games with massive variables, which SC2 has, is that we are in for quite a delay.

Fear not, disheartened ones, it is either delay or incompetency from the AI, which do you prefer?

My vote is delay...get it as good as possible and release at the end of February, early March, patches come later.

[JerseyJohn]

Ah, good to see this discussion moved away from that stirred up hornets nest.

Great ideas, Dave and Edwin.

[Edwin P.]

Although the Activation script will activate a nation, I wonder if there is a script which will change a nation from pro-UK to pro-Goviet or pro-German.

I ask this as I can think of several cases where I might want to randomly change the default leaning of a nation. Thus I could have Spain randomly activate as a Soviet Minor Ally or a German Minor Ally or a UK Minor Ally.

Example:

3% Communists won the Spanish Civil War and Spain is an active Soviet Minor Ally.

3% Communists won the Civil war and Spain is Soviet leaning.

91% Fascists win the war and Spain is a neutral Fascist republic.

3% Spain is an active German Minor Ally and a member of the Axis Alliance.

Simarily, I wonder if the event editor will allow one to change a nation from a minor nation to a major nation and a major nation to a minor nation.

Example:

98% - Italy is a Major Axis Nation (49 of 50 games)

1% - Italy is a neutral nation and Spain is a Major Axis nation

1% - Italy is a neutral nation and Turkey is a Major Axis nation

I also wonder if the scripts will allow one to change the terrain? What would have happened if France did not build the maginot line, but spent those resources on building a stronger army.

Thus:

Maginot line fortresses are replaced by weaker engineer built fortresses while Fance gains a HQ unit, an armor unit, and an engineer unit.

Or what if France extended the Maginot Line thus:

France gains Fortifications along the Belgium border and Germany (copying France) gains a bonus Engineer Unit.

[ December 31, 2005, 03:43 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

[Edwin P.]

Alternative French War Preparations:

When World War I ended and the Versailles Treaty began its devestation of Germany, the debate on the future of France's defenses began in earnest, for no one believed that Germany would stay down for long. Verdun was the heroic symbol of powerful fortifications. Joffre, its spokesman, favored a line of fortifications along France's eastern frontier with Germany, a series of defended concentration areas from which troops could counter any attack which attempted to penetrate between the defenses. Opposing him was Pétain, the hero of Verdun, who argued for defense in depth (like the Hindenburg Line). A third school, joined by the likes of Paul Reynaud and Charles de Gaulle, argued for a buildup of tanks and planes. But this meant mobility and attack, and France had no stomach for that.

96%: Maginot Line Built - Historical

2%: Maginot Line Not built, France gains 2 Armor and 2 Air Fleets

2%: Line of Fortifications built from Switzerland to the English Channel

[Edwin P.]

Alternative German Naval Strategy

What if Germany instead of using steel to build surface warships used these resources to build subsmarines?

Example: German Submarine Warfare Variant

Germany gains 6 more sub fleets (for a total of 300 subs vs the original 50 subs Germany started the war with) but loses its surface warfare fleets.

I can use Unit Scripts to give them extra sub units, but can I use the scripts to take away surface fleets and surface units in production?

PS: What the editor really needs; if it does not have it, is some sort of decision tree support (ie IF..Else or Case).

[ December 31, 2005, 06:02 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

[Retributar]

Edwin P. ... now this discussion...'Alternative History Generator,... is just what i like...thank's for initiating this discussion.

That is not to say that i have no yearning for a 'HISTORICAL - GAME' ...but, trying out 'ALTERNATIVE HISTORIES' ... can also be massively fun i should think!.

[Blashy]

All of these can be accomplished by planners with the editor.

There is no need to ask Hubert to litterely "waste" his time, or "DELAY" the game even further.

He will come with a basic historical probabilities and if you wish to change some of these it will be VERY easy to do.

The product we have now is very good, well balanced and visually polished.

But all these possible for this and that to happen will have to be done by the players, they are just too many different ideas and different visions of what ifs for Hubert to ever satisfy everyone's needs. Although he did the next best thing, he came out with an editor that gives the chance for anyone to come out with their needs. Not many games offer this possibility and they are certainly not a one man team.