Loki & Ziu Posted October 14, 2002 Share Posted October 14, 2002 I bought "Panzer Aces" (Franz Kurowski´s book on 6 top german tankers) looking for eastern front descriptions of fighting at a tactical level. It was a long time to wait for CMBB when I read it, and I could not help portraying in my imagnation not the real-world action, but how wolud it look on CMBB. The scale of the actions described suits perfectly the game and, unlike other books focused on the political or strategical picture, this one goes straight to the action: you have a scenario intro almost on any page you may pick randomly. But mine is a sad story, as I have not been able to materialize those pages into furious steel-shatering battles (my copy is still on its way) Meanwhile I beg some information from the lucky ones who are alraedy designig/playing CMBB scenarios. Has somebody who has read the book recognized it as a source for a scenario he has played? or, has somebody designed scenarios or operations based on this book? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianc Posted October 14, 2002 Share Posted October 14, 2002 I've designed some Steel Panthers scens from it. One of my favorite actions is Albert Ernst's support of the attack on Xanino. I did an SP scen on this, but am working on converting it to CMBB now. Slow going... ianc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki & Ziu Posted October 15, 2002 Author Share Posted October 15, 2002 Thanks for your reply, ianc. I am anxious to play that scenario if you make it available. Another specially interesting would be a Kursk scenario featuring Rudolf von Ribbentrop. I am dying to see all these crack tankers causing havoc in a similar way already witnessed in CMBO "Villers-Bocage". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianc Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Yes, the book is quite excellent and available in paperback now too. I picked up a copy for, I believe, $8.95 at Borders, although I had read it before. The book has been discussed here before, but it does provide some very relevant material to the scenario designer. Some of Bix's maneuvers would be very nice as well... ianc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Leader Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 "Infantry Aces" is also excellent and also available in pulp paperback. Also keep an eye out for "Panzer Aces 2" and "Luftwaffe Aces" (OT but I bet it's still good) coming soon! Great books! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazed Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 I looked at panzer aces on amazon some time ago. All the reviewers panned it. Mayhap I'll pick it up anyway... Q Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpius1001 Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Sorry but this book is a dud..., maybe somthing was lost in the translations but little tech. info is given plus no maps.........There writing is stale and obviously re-creates accounts that could not have been witnessed by those involved..(youll understand if you read it..)..Plus I cant tell you how many times the author uses the phrase.."only to have the shell hit the frontal armour and riccochette upward"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offtaskagain Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Originally posted by scorpius1001: Sorry but this book is a dud..., maybe somthing was lost in the translations but little tech. info is given plus no maps.........There writing is stale and obviously re-creates accounts that could not have been witnessed by those involved..(youll understand if you read it..)..Plus I cant tell you how many times the author uses the phrase.."only to have the shell hit the frontal armour and riccochette upward"...Are you insane? The book is one of the most exciting i've ever read. It's not meant to have any techinical info in it. It's purely about the actions the subjects took part in. It's got a bit of fictional stuff because most of it's based off of the medal citations. However portions of it are quoted from interviews with the veterans. The section on Ribbentrop in particular has alot of him telling the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Leader Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 True, it's not pure historical fact. True, it is neither technical nor detailed in all aspects. True, there are certain parts that are not strictly factual. True, it is not literature, and the translator is probably "His english friend down the street" But it is also true that it is a rip-roarin' ride from the cupola of a number of tanks locked in deadly combat throughout the war, and, being written (IIRC) by a journalist from the Wermacht' paper, who was PRESENT(!) during or directly after many of these escapades, gives a little bit of truth and humanization to the whole thing. Honestly, it would be impossible to find anything BETTER for the purpose served! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Murray Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 I read Kurowski's Infantry Aces book a couple of years ago. It put me off him as an author. Much of his writing is purely anecdotal with little in the way of hard fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianc Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Much of his writing is purely anecdotal with little in the way of hard fact.So if it's not verified, certainteed, 100% genoowine fax ma'am, it's no good? What about 'Cross of Iron', 'The Forgotten Soldier', and just good rip-roarin' fiction in general? ianc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generale_Pasquini Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Has anyone made or planning on making any scenarios based on Panzer Battles by Mellenthin... I read this book a few summer ago and it would be fun to play a few scenarios on it... (I don't remember how small unit it actually was but its worht a try)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Rock Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Originally posted by Panzer Leader: ...and, being written (IIRC) by a journalist from the Wermacht' paper, who was PRESENT(!) during or directly after many of these escapades, gives a little bit of truth and humanization to the whole thing.Yeah, if you can't trust a paid propagandist from the Nazi war machine, who can you trust? (ducks) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSword Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 But fact is: The Soviets had 12'000 tanks at 1. Jan. 1943. Produced around 20'000 during 1943 and at the beginning of 1944 had maybe around 15'000 - 17'000 tanks, the rest was unusuable, and not to the smaller part because of german action of which the few tanks (seldom more then 1500 operational) had their fair share. Greets Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWB Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 See the Hornet's Nest scenario on the CD for some Panzer Aces type action . . . WWB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianc Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 I saw that scenario and eagerly opened it up thinking you might have saved me the trouble of transcribing Xanino, but alas... ianc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tha_Field_Marshall Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 I can't recall the title but the book written by (or about Hans Von Lucke, sp?) would be a good one to create some scenarios from. I'll try to dig it out and re-read. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinkins Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 While we are on the topic: Panzer Aces - check out "Wittmann in the East" on the CD too. Infantry Aces - Boots and Tracks is testing "Schreiber's Stand". There are dozens of scenarios in these books. Given the interest I would like more posts regarding the historical accuracy of both books. I think they are better than historical fiction. But given the level of detail some license was taken. Was Kurowski in the same outfit as Carrell? Kevin Boots and Tracks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 Originally posted by Kevin Kinscherff: Was Kurowski in the same outfit as Carrell? Kevin Boots and TracksCarell was in no outfit. Unsurprisingly, he lied about his background. He never got near the front. His job was chief of propaganda for the Nazi foreign office, an SS-Obersturmbannfuehrer, and member of the Nazi party since 1931 (before the Machtergreifung - i.e. he was a committed Nazi). He was also chief editor of Signal, purveyors of Nazi war porn in colour since 1940. His real name was Schmidt. How all this affected his writing and the historical accuracy of it, I leave up to the readers to judge. Here is the information in German. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renaud Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 Originally posted by Generale_Pasquini: Has anyone made or planning on making any scenarios based on Panzer Battles by Mellenthin... I read this book a few summer ago and it would be fun to play a few scenarios on it... (I don't remember how small unit it actually was but its worht a try)...The best german general staff account I have read. However there are few actions described which could be adapted to CM scale battles. Not surprising considering General Mellenthin was a staff officer in Corp and Army groups. Mellenthin was rarely if ever at the front. It was his job to manage the static HQ when the commanding generals were running about in their command vehicles. Which also happens to put him in an ideal position to provide a good overview of the campaigns in which he participated. Ren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fridericus Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 the best book about tank-aces that i know, is "panzerkampf im bild" by will fry. he was kightcross-holder and tankplatoonleader in 2.ss.pz.div. "das reich" i think the best translation of title would be " tankbattle in picture" ISBN is 3-89555-034-5 thats real tactics and superior material Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawyer Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 Originally posted by scorpius1001: Sorry but this book is a dud..., maybe somthing was lost in the translations but little tech. info is given plus no maps.........There writing is stale and obviously re-creates accounts that could not have been witnessed by those involved..(youll understand if you read it..)..Plus I cant tell you how many times the author uses the phrase.."only to have the shell hit the frontal armour and riccochette upward"...I agree entirely. Everytime I try to read this book, my eyes glaze over. What a bore! Panzer Leader thinks no book could be better. Why am I not surprised? When he learns to read, he will find many far more interesting accounts. He can start with the Russian Battlefield site (to entertain him at "work") or go straight to "War Without Garlands", which (fortunately for PL) has PICTURES! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Leader Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 Lawyer, aren't you that GIT I beat defending against the assault with a final score of 98-2? Or was that your evil-twin jdmorse? I have scoured the .ru site, and I can top your "War WIthout Garlands" and I will raise you a "Panzers on the Eastern Front" which hasn't any pictures, but does have MAPS! Now then, I know you've been trolling for another whippin' and I am perfectly happy to (slaughter you) send another set-up, again defending, however, first you must Make Your Challenge Public and I think you know what I mean... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawyer Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 I personally have never stooped to "playing" you, but I have observed your nauseous ways and your vile image when I frittered my limited time away on the MBT. jdmorse is a sick man who deserves to lose to you. Does he tell you that I got a total AI surrendered victory from him before he took advantage of my innocence to beat me in the snow? Of course not, he's been dodging me ever since. So I know it must come to pass that I smash your neo-Nazi self to dust. You don't deserve my attention, but you do deserve to die At The Hands Of The Law. Yes, I know I must make an appearance in the Cesspool to be official. So it is written, so it shall be done. Done, that is, when I get damned good and ready. Life is busy these days, but I shall see to it in gub'ment time. Meanwhile, you can sweat profusely at night knowing The Lawyer is coming to ruin your pathetic little life. I'm sure your wife will think the fearful sweat and excessive bed moisture you generate is due to the annual "excitement" when you try to convince her you really are "a man." Hahahaha...... Must be KC love... Ya GIT! [ October 15, 2002, 09:46 PM: Message edited by: Lawyer ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlas_TH Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 Originally posted by Generale_Pasquini: Has anyone made or planning on making any scenarios based on Panzer Battles by Mellenthin... I read this book a few summer ago and it would be fun to play a few scenarios on it... (I don't remember how small unit it actually was but its worht a try)...Yes, the scenario is "Action at Manutchskaya," based on the battle described in "Panzer Battles," by Maj.Gen.F.W. von Mellenthin. You will find the scenario at the Scenario Depot. Agree with Renaud. Great book but not MUCH ELSE besides "Action at Manutchskaya" as far as small unit action descriptions on the Eastern Front. [ October 15, 2002, 09:54 PM: Message edited by: Atlas_TH ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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