How to simulate an opposed airborne drop and other scenarios

[Michael Dorosh]

Just trying out some "special missions" for some proposed "campaign" rules, and set up a test of some ideas.

I picked a random map and a German force, set them up on the map, padlocked them, and set the entire map as the red "allied" setup zone.

I saved the file, then opened up a Quick Battle. Picked Soviet Airborne, infantry only, random casualties (to simulate casualties in the drop), computer picked forces, then chose to play as Axis, without purchasing any additional forces (you have to pick one unit though, the QB won't let you pick absolutely nothing).

Only one test isn't much to go on, but it seemed to simulate the confusion of an opposed airborne drop pretty well. Russian units set up next to German ones.

The only drawback I can think of is that the AI would be more likely to set up in cover terrain - trees or buildings - whereas paratroops probably wouldn't be lucky enough to land safe and sound in such terrain.

Thought I'd pass this on for anyone interested. Anyone else have any ideas for special scenarios or victory conditions?

I'm trying to come up with some "standard" types of missions rather than the exotic "commando mission" style stuff.

Others I've thought about -

RELIEF IN PLACE UNDER FIRE

More fun to do from the Axis side since you can use different nationalities and easily tell the units apart - one company sets up in defensive positions, the relief company enters as reinforcements on turn 2. The company on map is all marked for exit points to the Axis rear - the reinforcement company is not.

As everyone knows, the worst thing a unit can do is tip off the enemy that they are having a relief in place, since the enemy will use the opportunity to attack or throw his artillery in, catching two units in a vulnerable spot.

Anyone else?

[ October 19, 2002, 11:05 PM: Message edited by: Michael Dorosh ]

[Michael Emrys]

Ingenious, Michael! You must be taking your vitamins again.

Michael

[MrSpkr]

Simple on the covered terrain bit, Michael -- make those areas neutral, keeping the AI from using them.

Steve

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally posted by MrSpkr:

Simple on the covered terrain bit, Michael -- make those areas neutral, keeping the AI from using them.

Steve

This is why I keep you around....do I owe you a turn or vice versa?

[busboy]

You could allow them to land in the trees, but set a fairly high number of casualties to simulate busted limbs and such, but I like the neutral ground idea better.

[History Buff]

The only drawback I can think of is that the AI would be more likely to set up in cover terrain - trees or buildings - whereas paratroops probably wouldn't be lucky enough to land safe and sound in such terrain.

I think thats actually realistic. You could say the scenario begins a few minutes after the landing. When troops have mustered in shelter to regroup. Just the casultie rate should be set to high.

[argie]

IIRC, the average casualty rate of all WWII airborne together, was something like 10 - 15% (if not less).

So, don't abuse of the Casualy feature.

More accurate will be to set all them as Half Squads, if possible.

[ October 20, 2002, 10:12 AM: Message edited by: Ariel ]

[Sgt. Schultz]

I was thinking one could make a scenario where the paras drop onto designated reinforcement points all over the map, a platoon or so at a time. This takes away a lot of the replay value put gives you the flow and confusion of a drop. Every turn another drop is made for the first few turns. Then the paras need to re-group and assault their VLs.

Imagine shifting a 'toon to deal with a drop and having another 'toon drop on top of you....

You could of course set it up in the editor for the troops to drop in various stages of fitness and ammo supply. I have not tried it but it may even be possible for one to set multiple reinforcement locations for the same turn. So reinforcements 2 and 3 and 4 could all drop the same turn but in widely seperate locations. It could be quite a mess for a Btn of paras to drop right onto a fortified position.

[ October 20, 2002, 02:12 PM: Message edited by: Sgt. Schultz ]

[MrSpkr]

Originally posted by Michael Dorosh:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by MrSpkr:

Simple on the covered terrain bit, Michael -- make those areas neutral, keeping the AI from using them.

Steve

This is why I keep you around....do I owe you a turn or vice versa?</font>

[MrSpkr]

Originally posted by Ariel:

IIRC, the average casualty rate of all WWII airborne together, was something like 10 - 15% (if not less).

So, don't abuse of the Casualy feature.

More accurate will be to set all them as Half Squads, if possible.

That could be misleading. Do you have a figure on the casualty rate of combat jumps?

Also, keep in mind the 'casualties' might not necessarily be dead or wounded -- they could be missing -- i.e., guys who simply haven't made it to the rendezvous point yet. Look at the AMerican airdrops over Normandy -- they were lucky to get more than 100 men together for the first 8-12 hours.

Steve

[argie]

Originally posted by MrSpkr:

That could be misleading. Do you have a figure on the casualty rate of combat jumps?

Also, keep in mind the 'casualties' might not necessarily be dead or wounded -- they could be missing -- i.e., guys who simply haven't made it to the rendezvous point yet. Look at the AMerican airdrops over Normandy -- they were lucky to get more than 100 men together for the first 8-12 hours.

Steve

I used to have in my computer the exactly rundown of men and material lost in the Normandy jumping for the 82nd... But damned if I can found it now!!!

Anyway, most of the statistcs I'm quoting from memory I've found in a paper on modern possibility of using gliders... I will try a search on the net.

[argie]

I can't found that paper yet. But I found this.

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by Ariel:

But I found this.

Man, that was weird! I think the internet has become the New York City of the 21st. Century.

Michael

[argie]

Well, I can't found the paper... If I have some luck, I may have it in a Notebook I've borrowed to a friend.

I was surprised for the statistics too, when I read it first. BTW, I was investigating how to make the rules for Airdrops for CMMC when I found that work.

[barrage]

Other scenario ideas:

Armored/mechanized breakouts. Do you think there are good scenarios or operations? I was visualizing a large map with the defender having to place blocking forces to cover several avenues of advance. Either defending a particular site or blocking enemy from exiting from an area. The attacker would have a choice of lanes for advance.

River crossings either opposed or unopposed. I'd like to see more of these type scenarios.

My 2 cents.

Doug