Casualties in CMx1

[Darkmath]

I just wonder whether the routing soldiers are taken into account in the casualty number.

Since the casualties of an unit happen at the moment the unit getting shot at, it seems unlikely.

Or maybe the actual casualty frequency is higher enough to include KIA/WIA and routed soldiers?

[The_Enigma]

I dont believe it counts routed units, although i may be wrong, i wouldnt see why it should since there technically still alive.

[Darkmath]

When a soldier is fleeing away, i don't think he would join back his squad within a 30 min. battle, or even join it at all.

However, in a CMBO operation, I notice the casualty number of some unit decrease in the next battle. This means WIA -and eventually routed soldier- from the first battle are ready to fight again in the next one.

Personally, i don't think routed soldier are included; if so, the casualty number would increase when the unit doesn't recieve a shot and is already panicked.

If there is a reply about this by the devs in the archive, it would be cool.

[stikkypixie]

I thought those guys were replacements.

[Darkmath]

80 oh,really?

I didn't think about that .

[Darkmath]

So, when a single soldier routs, the whole squad routs too?

[Darkmath]

Actually, is the KIA/WIA number enough in the high casualties numbers which occurs at the end of the battle?

I don't find any official reply about the nature of the casualty. So, is the routed units are modelled in the casualty number?

[dieseltaylor]

No

[Darkmath]

Lol

Thanks for the short answer

[The_Enigma]

removed

[ August 22, 2006, 03:25 PM: Message edited by: the_enigma ]

[tankibanki]

No, the casualties number includes the killed soldiers, but not the captured ones.

[dieseltaylor]

Incidentally the KIA figure is randomly generated from the Casualty figure. You can open and close the final file and I understand the KIA is not necessarily the same on each viewing.

[The_Enigma]

Sorry for the stuipd question above, its in the manual

Total Casualties – total number of soldiers put out of action

Men Killed in Action – how many men of the above total were

killed. The others are considered more or less heavily wounded.

[Darkmath]

In the CMBO, here what is written is the manual, page 29 ;

Casualties

The number besides the numbers of dead,wounded, or otherwise incapacitated or missing (in other words: INACTIVE) members of the selected unit.

"Missing"? A routed individual soldier maybe?

:confused:

Note it is the only excerpt which mentions "missing" members.

BTW, since the KIA and WIA are calculated AFTER the battle ended, are considered KIA soldiers who was first incapacitated then died by their wounds during the battle?

[ August 23, 2006, 03:13 AM: Message edited by: Darkmath ]

[Wicky]

Part of an intact 'damaged' (squad/crew/hq) individually can't rout only a unit as a whole.

[Darkmath]

I may ask the question in a different way, closer to CMX1 engine.

Is a lower morale status increase the casualty rate?

That is, under the same suppression condition and, with different inital morale condition (one squad pinned and another under panic) comparing the casualty rate of the units by running several tests.

However, I think there are still too much variable taken into account ; for example, when a unit is broken, the casualties comes when the unit is fleeig away, that is on the move.And the casualties rate is higher because the units is running.

In this case ,he units should be in the same movement status (stationnary) at the moment they are taking casualties in order to be able to compare the units, since only morale is different between them.

I don't know if this kind of test would be enough to answer to the question.

What do you think?

[Darkmath]

I ran a test a dozen times (not a significant enough sample,however) with the following conditions;

-Terrain exclusively made of open ground (to prevent the units moving to a more covered terrain type).

A T cliff seperate each unit and its corresponding enemy (US 45 squads vs.HMG42 at 40 metres)

-One squad begin the battle with shaken suppression.

The other one is under panic.

Both are taking cover (hiding)

From what I see, the panicking unit is more prompt to go away. They crawl first, then they run when they have "routed" status.

While they are staying at the same place (10-20 sec.) , they took at most 2 casualties. The casualty rate grow when they move.

The other unit stay longer against the MG42. They took at most 2 casualties.

It seems that the morale status doesn't increase the casualty rate. It is when a unit is moving who took an higher casualty rate.

So, single soldiers fleeing away are not included in the casualties.

(IMSHO ,I don't think it is a problem to include it in the existing casualty number . It could avoid the full squad routing without any casualty.)