Your position on replaying...

[Dark Knight]

Ever since I first started playing CM, I've had a habit of quitting in frustration and loading up a previous save to play again. I felt somewhat guilty because of this, but then I started to wonder whether what I was doing was normal. What do you guys think? Should a person stay in the game and continue playing no matter what happens or is it ok to loadup previous saves with the knowledge of what's going to happen?

[Voodoochile]

Hi!

Personally, I never replay my turns. I try to approach the game as a real commander would approach a real battle. If something bad happens to my troops as a result of my errors in judgement.....TOUGH! I take it on the chin and just assess what went wrong so I can try not to do it again in the future. I would'nt enjoy it if my opponent had the luxury of replaying turns that did'nt go "his way". Why should I do the same?

I play this game because I find it very stimulating.......mentally. Don't get any wrong ideas folks! Replaying my turns would spoil the challenge and the learning experience for me.

In a nutshell, the way I look at it is learn from your mistakes and try to do the best you can with what you have.

[Michael Emrys]

First of all, your knowledge of what is going to happen is less than perfect. Let me explain: Every time you load a saved turn and then hit Go, you will get a different result because of the number of random elements in the game. So a tank that got brewed in one playing might not in another, etc. The farther back you go to restart your replay, even if you don't give any different orders, the greater the disparity will tend to be due to an accumulation of these random factors and their influence.

To answer your main question, I don't usually go back to replay a turn, though I do save each turn in order to keep the option open. The only times I've ever done it were when I had a really interesting game going and ruined it either by doing something incredibly stupid or by a blight of sheer bad luck, or if I wanted to go back to the beginning to see what a different approach would do. Mostly I just play straight through. If a person is a beginner, and I see by your member number that you are not, they should especially not feel bad about replaying a turn, as that is often the best way to learn to see a better way of doing a particular thing. But in doing so, one should be trying to distill general principles that will serve well in many situations rather then try to "crack" a particular battle or scenario that has that patch of trees in that exact place, etc.

Michael

[GreenAsJade]

I almost never play the AI, so it's a slightly moot question, but even when I do play the AI I'm with the gang that treat it as real. If I goofed up a scenario, hey all those guys are dead and the enemy has that place captured now... luckily I still have my commission and I'm on to the next battle.

But by-and-large playing the AI is so boring that replaying a turn would kill me from boredom!

One real exception to "treating it as real" was a CMBB scenario that a guy on Scenario Talk was developing called Pohlersilta. That was a really fascinating scenario based on a story about a young sergent (or some such) having dreams about his first defense assignment... and each dream he messed it up, but gradually learned some lessons about defense.

The scenario offered the opportunities to try the defense yourself first, then read the story, then try again. Fascinating exercise, and that caused replay of a whole scenario... but not just replay of a turn, so I guess I'm getting off topic. It was a good scenario though! Don't know if it ever got published...

Enough rambling for one post!

GaJ

[Ant]

Originally posted by Dark Knight:

Ever since I first started playing CM, I've had a habit of quitting in frustration and loading up a previous save to play again. I felt somewhat guilty because of this, but then I started to wonder whether what I was doing was normal. What do you guys think? Should a person stay in the game and continue playing no matter what happens or is it ok to loadup previous saves with the knowledge of what's going to happen?

I think you're suffering the same affliction that I used to.....you're taking a game too seriously. You're getting frustrated when things don't go right and your main priority is to win. Nothing necessarily wrong with that but, seriously, I found out that I just increased my enjoyment by treating it as a game and realising the main aim is not to win...it's to have fun.

So what if you lose? It's just a game. Fire up a new scenario and play that one sfterwards. It may sound obvious, and it may not work for you, but once I realised that the whole point wasn't to win but to simply enjoy the game I became far less frustrated and enjoyed it far more. You'll also probably find that you learn more from your mistakes if you play through the consequences rather than just aborting and reloading.

[Other Means]

i used to do that, when i was first learning the units etc.

if you're just trying out idea's then it's fine. but i was trying to get to where i could compete with people so it's not the best training for that.

[THumpre]

Good God man, you are waaaaaay too serious about this game When you lose as many PBEM games as I have you come to understand the true beauty of the game is in the playing not the winning...at least that's what i keep telling myself

[Fluf]

When I first got CMBO I created small training battles for myself based on typical real WWII situations - things like clearing a hamlet of light holding forces/snipers with a platoon of infantry, up to assaulting a heavily defended line with a battalion and tank support. I would treat these as training exercises, and experiment as I saw fit, changing the force makeups, troop qualities, adding/subtracting support weapons, etc. etc. to get a feel for the way a battlefield worked.

In training exercises I feel free to retake moves a lot, experimenting with different tactics.

Then I attempt an "official" scenario that I haven't played yet and treat it like a real battle, with no take backs, in order to feel a bit what battalion level command might be like - to live with the loses taken under my direction. I've read many accounts of real battles which criticize commanders for not doing their job right. Doing it right the first time turns out to be pretty difficult sometimes, as the Combat Mission simulators prove. It's a sobering and very challenging experience if you pretend for a moment that your men were real at the end of a battle.

So, in 'real' battles I do not retake moves, I force myself to live with the consequences.

The good news is that the training exercises have paid off for me. My first attack in CMAK proper (after the demos) was an 85% win with minimal casualties against a smaller but high quality enemy force. This was due to what proved to be a good battle plan (with hindsight), good co-operation between my combat elements, and as always, a bit of luck.

I find these 'real' battles so engrossing that I have accidentally stayed up all night on more than one occasion - not noticing the passage of time.

"How do you get to Carnegie Hall? Practice, my boy, practice!"

[Boo Radley]

Yeah, I sometimes do if I want to see what alternative orders might do, like, "Well, using that plan, all my troops got killed in under a minute...let's see what happens using Plan B."

That kind of thing.

[MeatEtr]

Simply put, do replays only for experimentation/training and not to beat the odds, or to cheat. (to win a tank duel or find out enemy locations then go back)

[Dark Knight]

Enthralling...

Actually, my computer is much too crappy to play either CM:BB or CM:AK right now, but I did buy and continue to enjoy the original CM:BO. I was just trying out CM:AK (with all the effects off and still at about 3 fps) and the thought came to me, so I thought I'd post about it here!

Thanks for the kind responses, guys!