Learning to use big guns--War Story

[laze and blaze]

After reading some posts from this forum I started uping the caliber of my arty strikes and buying 150mm Hummels. They have helped with smashing Russian infantry attacks in QBs.

I'm using a 150mm infantry gun for the first time in my latest QB (I'm Germans on the defense). It's a regular crew, but they have really shined in battle. The 150mm IG is set on the right-center portion of the map (medium size, moderate trees, moderate hills) in a patch of tall trees just behind and to the left of a platoon of sturmgenadiers and 2 HMGs.

The AI has two main avenues of approach with his infantry. I set up the IG to cover the right avenue. I had to open fire earlier than I wanted to because one of my ATGs that I really needed was getting hammered by two MGs and ISU-152s. The IG routed the MGs after a few rounds, but that brought some unwanted attention from two T-34/85s on the left side of the map. They were about 450-480 meters away from my IG. I thought the IG would have a short life, but both tanks have apparently expended all their HE rounds trying to take this valiant IG crew out. They have sat there and fired for about 10 turns often forcing the crew to go to ground, but the IG crew has never broken. Now the tank fire has slackened and my IG is going to work on the the Russian infantry attack on the right side. The Sturmgenadiers, 2 HMGs and a 105mm arty strike were able to deal with the first part of the attack, but the Russians keep coming! I brought up a Hummel from the right rear and together with my IG they are giving 150mm therapy sessions to any infantry that bunches up. My sturmgrenadiers and HMGs are down to 2-3 ammo. My Hummel is out of ammo and my IG has 7 rounds left. I have one a platoon of infantry and one ATG covering the victory flag about 250 meters to the rear. I hope it will be enough.

On the left side of the battle there is a bunch of woods and a church with the forward-most small victory flag. I couldn't deploy troops to the far (enemy) side of the woods due to set-up zone forward limit, so I set up a platoon of sturmgrenadiers inside the woods with a flame thrower. There is also a HMG, a HQ and an infantry squad in the church with a flame thrower in the church too.

The sturmgrenadiers in the woods put up a good fight, but were quickly overrun. After eating my sturmgrenadiers as an appetizer, the Russians began licking their lips in anticipation of taking the small victory flag in the church some 50 meters away. They began suppressing my church defenders and sending squads rushing toward the church. That's when I called in the 150mm arty into the woods. This was a crushing blow! No Russians of any consequence have ventured out of the woods since the arty strike 10 turns ago. In fact, the only troops I've seen that went into the woods came running out of the far side about midway through the arty strike. Then I plastered them with the IG gun and they turned around and ran back into the woods. I'm sure they are in there, huddled together and quaking with fear.

My point of this post is that I'm getting much better results from the big stuff against the massed AI infantry attacks. 105mm arty would not have stopped the left side attack by itself like the 150mm did. 105mm SPs and 105mm IGs would not be stopping the right side attack like my valiant, soon to be veteran, 150mm IG gun crew. I used to use 81mm arty because they were cheap and they had lots of rounds. I'm learning that you get what you pay for!

I'm sure an experienced human would have taken apart my defense like a Mercedes in an East L.A. chop shop, but I'm learning. And when I get a little better I'll try my luck against you guys.

[Generaloberst Guderian]

I attempted to do a quantitative comparison of different calibers but couldn't post it so that it was legible. If I can figure out a good way to display the results I'll get back to you.

[flamingknives]

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Plus, the reason the 150mm gun did so well may have been a fanatic crew. Most times a 150mm gun crew would rout under fire from two 85mm armed T34s

[ May 08, 2005, 12:01 PM: Message edited by: flamingknives ]

[JasonC]

Or is was the crest effect "feature"...

[MeatEtr]

Originally posted by JasonC:

Or is was the crest effect "feature"...

That's exactly what im thinking. Although i thought this crest effect was done away with from a patch a long time ago. Since a gun could be un-KOable from direct HE fire.

Because IMO, this pretty much never happens anymore.

two T-34/85s were about 450-480 meters away from my IG... but both tanks have apparently expended all their HE rounds trying to take this valiant IG crew out.

Im guessing the tanks didn't have much HE shells left anyway.

[Beta1]

LOl you think 150mm is good - try the 200+ stuff with lots of TRPs. You can buy the FOs at conscript level and the TRP brings the target on target and on time.

You really dont want to be anywhere near the 300mm+ shells!

[Bone_Vulture]

The field 150mm guns have a superior price to ammo ratio in relation to similar FO artillery units. The only major advantage off-board artilery has is the ability to fire beyond the LOS of the spotter, with the aid of the mentioned TRP's.

[Generaloberst Guderian]

I think you're definitely right about the heavier caliber artillery, especially the on map 150 L/12. The real difference lies in the relative blast power of each weapon system. Rather than trying to assess the value of different calibers via speculation and anectdotal experience, I've attempted to compare their relative power quantitatively. I went into the editor and recorded the blast values and ammunition for each type of German artillery observer. I then multiplied the blast value by the ammunition count. This value, which I've called firepower, should represent the maximum HE support that each observer could bring down upon the enemy, assuming perfect accuracy. Keep in mind however, that rocket artillery etc is not at all accurate, and if anyone can think of a good way to do it, we could develop some type of firepower correction modifier to account for intrinsically poor accuracy:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Caliber: Blast: Ammo: Firepower

75mm 45 25 1,125

81mm mtr 26 150 3,900

105mm 114 60 6,840

150mm 299 35 10,465

170mm 452 20 9,040

210mm 708 20 14,160

240mm 957 18 17,226

158rkt 202 108 21,816

280rkt 633 72 45,576

337rkt 377 72 27,144</pre>

[Other Means]

Very interesting, thanks for that. Would it be possible to factor in is the spread of the arty? That way you have the firepower being proportional to it's effect on the target area.

[Generaloberst Guderian]

Hmm...there probably is a way, assuming you know the average spread covered by a target area. I suppose what I could try to do is call in an artillery strike in an open field, and then using a quick vehicle and the LOS tool, I could measure the width and lenght of the affected part of the map. Then I could calculate the total area, and divide the firepower by that number, thus giving us a firepower/sq meter value, or something along that line. I'll get back to you if that turns out to be a practicable method.